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Author Topic: A Proposal Re: #Taijitu_Tavern  (Read 4676 times)

Offline Dyr Nasad

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Re: A Proposal Re: #Taijitu_Tavern
« Reply #30 on: November 23, 2015, 05:27:38 AM »
Also Dyr, your opinion is invalid, since you're kinda the reason we need legislation on this channel. You've said on record that you don't do RP/worldbuidling and never will, yet you're an OP at #taijitu_tavern, sooooo. Maybe if you resigned and stopped connecting there we wouldn't need this legislation.

Well that was a fun call out that chose to ignore the entirety of my post. I will repost for your benefit. I may not RP, but I imagine that reading would be a useful skill to have in a collaborative writing endeavor.

Legislating rules for IRC channels has never been a good idea, and it is not a good idea now.

I would also like to point out the second part of the description that is apparently being ignored "Taijitu worldbuilders/citizens only." I joined it as a citizen-only channel because #taijitu includes people from half of NS at this point.

And before my post gets jumped on - I welcome more RP-talk in the channel. Though I don't write, I still enjoy taijitu's writing. All it takes is people to show up and ...well... talk about RP.

My point of it as a citizen-only channel stands.

My point about other people being able to talk about RP also stands.

I suppose this does beg the question - if my presence is truly frightening enough to stop any RP-related conversation in its tracks, what other venues do you intend to ban me from? This forum (where RPs are posted)? The region (where RPers are recruited from)?

Most other players do not seem to find me to be that scary. The first examples that comes to mind are all those conversations about the IC languages (which I found interesting).

The line about my OP seems rather misplaced. We tend to OP everyone, I have proven myself to be excessively fair in moderation duties (for example, I accept individuals who demonstrate sustained and willful intellectual dishonesty - without banning them for trolling), and I do not believe I have ever abused that power (I welcome evidence to the contrary).

Offline Delfos

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Re: A Proposal Re: #Taijitu_Tavern
« Reply #31 on: November 23, 2015, 09:52:09 AM »
I motion to vote:

The Taijitu_Tavern Shittalk IRC Room Ban Act:
Considering and valuing all the efforts made to establish #Taijitu_Tavern as an RP oriented room to shift away from ill uses;

Recollecting the Tavern-Gate where many of our self-highly-regarded members were included in despicable discussions shit talking about other Taijituans;

Realizing that despite all efforts this channel still has the stigma of being a place to foul mouth about fellow Taijituans and our Allies as well as not serving the RP oriented purpose while being dominated by GamePlay discussion that those Traitor Babies keep undermining the efforts to clean the Tavern's reputation;

The Ecclesia hereby demands:
1. Lock-Down and/or Elimination of #Taijitu_Tavern
2. Ban to all Citizens joining in #Taijitu_Tavern or any revival attempts.
3. All those included in the shitttalking will have the special forum tag saying "Traitor Baby"
4. Guillotine Traitor Babies Myroria and Funkadelia for not even following through with their "hiatus" as they themselves proposed after Tavern-Gate.
-

As for RP discussion, we've ALWAYS used the main #Taijitu channel for RP discussion, it's a good way to keep activity in the Channel so I'd suggest we reinforce #Taijitu as a good medium to connect with Taijis, specially for RP discussion.
« Last Edit: November 23, 2015, 10:23:09 AM by Delfos »

Offline Eluvatar

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Re: A Proposal Re: #Taijitu_Tavern
« Reply #32 on: November 23, 2015, 11:07:08 AM »
Also Dyr, your opinion is invalid, since you're kinda the reason we need legislation on this channel. You've said on record that you don't do RP/worldbuidling and never will, yet you're an OP at #taijitu_tavern, sooooo. Maybe if you resigned and stopped connecting there we wouldn't need this legislation.

There are so many things wrong with that statement.

1. As Dyr's reiterated, he's interested in our RP discussions, he just won't RP his own nation.
2. Of all the guilty parties of venting about others in #taijitu_tavern, I believe Dyr Nasad is one of the least guilty. I suspect I was more guilty of it than he. (Correct me if I'm wrong, though, Dyr.)

I'm flabbergasted that you'd do this.

On the main point, I don't understand what prompted this. There's nothing stopping people using #taijitu_tavern for RP discussion. It's been used for it a great deal. I haven't heard it associated with badmouthing people in weeks, if not months.

Where's this initiative coming from?

I motion to vote:

The Taijitu_Tavern Shittalk IRC Room Ban Act:
Considering and valuing all the efforts made to establish #Taijitu_Tavern as an RP oriented room to shift away from ill uses;

Recollecting the Tavern-Gate where many of our self-highly-regarded members were included in despicable discussions shit talking about other Taijituans;

Realizing that despite all efforts this channel still has the stigma of being a place to foul mouth about fellow Taijituans and our Allies as well as not serving the RP oriented purpose while being dominated by GamePlay discussion that those Traitor Babies keep undermining the efforts to clean the Tavern's reputation;

The Ecclesia hereby demands:
1. Lock-Down and/or Elimination of #Taijitu_Tavern
2. Ban to all Citizens joining in #Taijitu_Tavern or any revival attempts.
3. All those included in the shitttalking will have the special forum tag saying "Traitor Baby"
4. Guillotine Traitor Babies Myroria and Funkadelia for not even following through with their "hiatus" as they themselves proposed after Tavern-Gate.
-

As for RP discussion, we've ALWAYS used the main #Taijitu channel for RP discussion, it's a good way to keep activity in the Channel so I'd suggest we reinforce #Taijitu as a good medium to connect with Taijis, specially for RP discussion.

No. Just...

Gameplay is just as valid a Taijituan affair as Roleplay is. Neither should be stigmatized.
« Last Edit: November 23, 2015, 11:17:56 AM by Eluvatar »
                                 
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Offline Myroria

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Re: A Proposal Re: #Taijitu_Tavern
« Reply #33 on: November 23, 2015, 02:36:54 PM »
I motion to vote:

The Taijitu_Tavern Shittalk IRC Room Ban Act:
Considering and valuing all the efforts made to establish #Taijitu_Tavern as an RP oriented room to shift away from ill uses;

Recollecting the Tavern-Gate where many of our self-highly-regarded members were included in despicable discussions shit talking about other Taijituans;

Realizing that despite all efforts this channel still has the stigma of being a place to foul mouth about fellow Taijituans and our Allies as well as not serving the RP oriented purpose while being dominated by GamePlay discussion that those Traitor Babies keep undermining the efforts to clean the Tavern's reputation;

The Ecclesia hereby demands:
1. Lock-Down and/or Elimination of #Taijitu_Tavern
2. Ban to all Citizens joining in #Taijitu_Tavern or any revival attempts.
3. All those included in the shitttalking will have the special forum tag saying "Traitor Baby"
4. Guillotine Traitor Babies Myroria and Funkadelia for not even following through with their "hiatus" as they themselves proposed after Tavern-Gate.
-

As for RP discussion, we've ALWAYS used the main #Taijitu channel for RP discussion, it's a good way to keep activity in the Channel so I'd suggest we reinforce #Taijitu as a good medium to connect with Taijis, specially for RP discussion.

I'm not putting up with this shit anymore. I've made my apologies. Maybe the reason this region turned to such shit is because of everyone's toxic disgusting attitude. Good luck, guys. I'm sure it will turn out great.
"I assure you -- I will be quite content to be a mere mortal again, dedicated to my own amusements."

Offline Delfos

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Re: A Proposal Re: #Taijitu_Tavern
« Reply #34 on: November 23, 2015, 02:43:52 PM »
Maybe the reason this region turned to such shit is because of everyone's toxic disgusting attitude.
Amen.

Offline Funkadelia

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Re: A Proposal Re: #Taijitu_Tavern
« Reply #35 on: November 23, 2015, 02:46:50 PM »
As you know, citizen Delfos, in this region we remove people by ostracism, not by being written into a bill. :)
« Last Edit: November 23, 2015, 02:53:40 PM by Funkadelia »
Today's date is: Today is Jocidi, 5 Cielidor AR 5 - Day 1770 of the Glorious Revolution.

Many trials make manifest
The stranger's fate, the curses' bane.
Many touchstones try the stranger
Many fall, but one remains.

Offline Of The US

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Re: A Proposal Re: #Taijitu_Tavern
« Reply #36 on: November 23, 2015, 03:23:35 PM »
I don't think Citizen-Delfos wants to remove certain people from the region, both you and Myro get a lot of shit for things, and arguably more than you deserve, the two of you are actually valued members of the region(though maybe not by Delfos, though who cares about his opinions, amirite?) Ostracism can be fun for the people doing it, having been on the side being ostracized, it is far from pleasant to watch people you like, and thought liked you just either ignore, or do things against you.
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Offline Khem

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Re: A Proposal Re: #Taijitu_Tavern
« Reply #37 on: November 23, 2015, 03:24:39 PM »
As you know, citizen Delfos, in this region we remove people by ostracism, not by being written into a bill. :)

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Offline Delfos

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Re: A Proposal Re: #Taijitu_Tavern
« Reply #38 on: November 23, 2015, 03:38:21 PM »
But...but...I don't want to ostracize people, I just want to cut their heads off.
 :guillotine:

I didn't mean to offend you.
« Last Edit: November 23, 2015, 04:35:03 PM by Delfos »

Offline Prydania

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Re: A Proposal Re: #Taijitu_Tavern
« Reply #39 on: November 23, 2015, 09:10:29 PM »
The line about my OP seems rather misplaced. We tend to OP everyone...
Just a correction here.
No. No we don't. I've been an on-and-off member of this region since almost, if not exactly, day one. I'm STILL not automatically OP'd in Taijitu IRC channels.
Not that I'm complaining, 'cause that's not my intent at all. Just sort of pointing it out. We don't OP everyone.

Well that was a fun call out that chose to ignore the entirety of my post. I will repost for your benefit. I may not RP, but I imagine that reading would be a useful skill to have in a collaborative writing endeavor.

Also Dyr, your opinion is invalid, since you're kinda the reason we need legislation on this channel. You've said on record that you don't do RP/worldbuidling and never will, yet you're an OP at #taijitu_tavern, sooooo. Maybe if you resigned and stopped connecting there we wouldn't need this legislation.

There are so many things wrong with that statement.

1. As Dyr's reiterated, he's interested in our RP discussions, he just won't RP his own nation.
No one's demanding Dyr exit the channel entirely. At least not from how I'm taking things.
If he wants to read RP discussions then he should be free to come on in, take a seat, and read what people have to say.

The problem is the OP thing. A IRC channel dedicated to Taijitu RPers and world builders shouldn't be controlled by people who have stated they have no interest in RPing themselves.
If Dyr wants to come in and read what's being discussed? All the power to him. He shouldn't have authority over people actually there to RP and world build though. Regardless of how responsible he's proven himself as a mod in other Taijitu IRC rooms.
« Last Edit: November 23, 2015, 09:17:59 PM by Prydainia »

Offline Funkadelia

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Re: A Proposal Re: #Taijitu_Tavern
« Reply #40 on: November 23, 2015, 09:17:41 PM »
OP and +O flags aren't the same thing. We do OP everyone, at least we try to. I don't remember if I have the ability to change flags, but only a few of us do, so auto flags aren't always assigned. And as I remember, you did have those flags for quite some time, but you hadn't signed in so long that your nick probably became de registered, which removes flags. In general, we try to OP everyone when we get the chance, which is different from most channels that selectively choose their OPs.
Today's date is: Today is Jocidi, 5 Cielidor AR 5 - Day 1770 of the Glorious Revolution.

Many trials make manifest
The stranger's fate, the curses' bane.
Many touchstones try the stranger
Many fall, but one remains.

Offline Prydania

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Re: A Proposal Re: #Taijitu_Tavern
« Reply #41 on: November 23, 2015, 09:22:49 PM »
OP and +O flags aren't the same thing. We do OP everyone, at least we try to. I don't remember if I have the ability to change flags, but only a few of us do, so auto flags aren't always assigned. And as I remember, you did have those flags for quite some time, but you hadn't signed in so long that your nick probably became de registered, which removes flags. In general, we try to OP everyone when we get the chance, which is different from most channels that selectively choose their OPs.
I don't recall ever having them, but that's neither here or there. The desire to OP everyone exists in the main #taijitu room.

This discussion is about #taijitu_tavern. It's always been about #taijitu_tavern. And I've never seen the same desire to OP everyone in that room. Now that's fine, really. It's just that if the room is going to have limited OPs? Those Ops should be world builders and RPers.
No offence to Dyr. His track record with OP powers in the main #taijitu room is indeed admirable. It's just that he really shouldn't have OP status in a room supposedly dedicated to RPers and world builders. Again, not a shot against him. I have no issue with him coming in if he wants to read take in what others are saying. He just shouldn't have the authority to moderate a room dedicated to a niche he himself has admitted he has no interest in participating in.
Much like how you guys shouldn't be expected to give me OP privileges in a hypothetical #taijitu_gameplay room.

Offline Funkadelia

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Re: A Proposal Re: #Taijitu_Tavern
« Reply #42 on: November 23, 2015, 09:24:10 PM »
I think OP issues should be discussed with the channel owners then, perhaps.
Today's date is: Today is Jocidi, 5 Cielidor AR 5 - Day 1770 of the Glorious Revolution.

Many trials make manifest
The stranger's fate, the curses' bane.
Many touchstones try the stranger
Many fall, but one remains.

Offline Prydania

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Re: A Proposal Re: #Taijitu_Tavern
« Reply #43 on: November 23, 2015, 09:26:10 PM »
I think OP issues should be discussed with the channel owners then, perhaps.
Well my goal with this discussion was to draw attention to the fact that the designated IRC channel for Taijitu's RPers and world builders was being neglected. The OP issues go along with that.

I'm not putting up with this shit anymore. I've made my apologies. Maybe the reason this region turned to such shit is because of everyone's toxic disgusting attitude. Good luck, guys. I'm sure it will turn out great.
I agree with this sentiment. I know that past events have tarnished #taijitu_tavern and that it's going to be impossible to divorce that from a discussion on the channel completely.
I don't want to drag past incidents up though. I want to talk about the future of the channel. As far as I'm concerned? Past incidents involving it are only important in so far as why I would like to see the channel redeemed, by returning it to its original and intended use.
« Last Edit: November 23, 2015, 09:28:55 PM by Prydainia »

Offline Prydania

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Re: A Proposal Re: #Taijitu_Tavern
« Reply #44 on: November 23, 2015, 09:38:21 PM »
On the main point, I don't understand what prompted this. There's nothing stopping people using #taijitu_tavern for RP discussion. It's been used for it a great deal. I haven't heard it associated with badmouthing people in weeks, if not months.
I'll do my best to answer as the person who raised this concern.
Taijitu has a strong RP and world building citizen base. And that sizeable group of people ought to have a space on IRC to discuss role playing and world building. #taijitu_tavern is, theoretically, that place. There are problems, however, in its current state.
The first is reputation. There's been unpleasantness that has soured many people to the idea of the room itself. What I'm calling for is essentially a symbolic gesture by the government of the region to officially state that it is the role play and world building channel. That it's for that purpose and only that purpose. And that anyone who wants to discuss those aspects of Taijitu can feel welcome coming in there.
The second is the OP status. As I said above it's unfair to give OP status to people who have expressly stated they have no desire to RP and world build. Again, they should be free to come in and read/listen if they want. They shouldn't, however, have the authority to moderate those that are there to role play and world build. Regardless of how spotless their track-records as OPs are.

Gulliver pointed out the possibility of just creating #taijitu_rp or a similarly named room. The idea is fine in theory. I just don't see the point of doing that if we have a room theoretically for role players and world builders. Let's reform the one we have rather then build a second one.

Quote
Gameplay is just as valid a Taijituan affair as Roleplay is. Neither should be stigmatized.
I agree. Entirely.
Which is why I'm asking for a dedicated space for Taijitu's role players and world builders on IRC. In a place that's already, theoretically, been set aside for them.