On Noble Houses

[Bustos]

But its so much work.  Simple pulling of a lever and OFF with their heads!   +1

[Myroria]

Please cease this spamming. The Ecclesia is meant for valuable discourse, not keeping score.

[Bustos]

Just trying to prove a point.

[St Oz]

spam spam spam spam

Blah blah blah, Noble Seals suck didn't you know

blah blah blah

[Gulliver]

I like the idea of the government not recognizing these titles, but I think with the language we're using in the bill we're altogether banning people from calling each other what they want like what Gulliver was saying. A private citizen asking to be called "Sir John of House Pretentious"  would be against the law in its current form because of the first clause. Asking to be called "Sir John of House Pretentious" can arguably be called "...join[ing], start[ing], or tak[ing] titles of nobility from a noble house..."

For that reason I say that we merely not acknowledge "houses of nobility" as opposed to banning citizens from joining them.

If we limit free speech by such measures I vow to start calling myself and others by nothing but noble titles.

Your absence of froth worries me.

[Myroria]

A Resolution to Further the Cause of Egalitarianism and the Glorious Revolution by the Outlawing of Noble Houses

1. No citizen of Taijitu shall join, start, or take titles of nobility from a noble house, foreign or otherwise.
2. If a foreigner belonging to a noble house applies for citizenship, it shall be granted. However, the citizen will be referred to by the government of Taijitu, when acting in an official capacity, as "Citizen [name]", and no reference will be made to their counterrevolutionary pedigree.
3. If a foreigner belonging to a noble house is assigned here as a dignitary, or resides in Taijitu without acquiring citizenship, they shall be referred to by the government of Taijitu, when acting in an official capacity, by their name only, and no reference will be made to their counterrevolutionary pedigree.

Wasn't sure what to do about clause 1.

[Gulliver]

Perhaps this could all be simplified as just "The Goverment of Taijitu will not recognize houses and titles of nobility."

[Funkadelia]

Perhaps this could all be simplified as just "The Goverment of Taijitu will not recognize houses and titles of nobility."

I like this idea.

[Cormac]

If Myroria would prefer to stick with the longer form -- it seems odd to just legislate a single sentence -- here's a suggestion for the first clause:

"1. The government of Taijitu, when acting in an official capacity, will not recognize any noble house or any title therefrom derived, foreign or otherwise."

A suggestion for a fourth clause:

"4. Citizens and foreign residents are encouraged, but not required, to avoid personal use of noble names or titles in Taijitu, as a demonstration of respect for the egalitarian principles of the Glorious Revolution."

[Khem]

I like the idea of the government not recognizing these titles, but I think with the language we're using in the bill we're altogether banning people from calling each other what they want like what Gulliver was saying. A private citizen asking to be called "Sir John of House Pretentious"  would be against the law in its current form because of the first clause. Asking to be called "Sir John of House Pretentious" can arguably be called "...join[ing], start[ing], or tak[ing] titles of nobility from a noble house..."

For that reason I say that we merely not acknowledge "houses of nobility" as opposed to banning citizens from joining them.

If we limit free speech by such measures I vow to start calling myself and others by nothing but noble titles.

Your absence of froth worries me.

Damn I thought it quite frothy

If Myroria would prefer to stick with the longer form -- it seems odd to just legislate a single sentence -- here's a suggestion for the first clause:

"1. The government of Taijitu, when acting in an official capacity, will not recognize any noble house or any title therefrom derived, foreign or otherwise."

A suggestion for a fourth clause:

"4. Citizens and foreign residents are encouraged, but not required, to avoid personal use of noble names or titles in Taijitu, as a demonstration of respect for the egalitarian principles of the Glorious Revolution."

Already dreaming up wonderful solutions Initiator I would certainly approve such.

[Dyr Nasad]

Sounds better - this is the meaning I had attributed to the original text of this proposal (likely incorrectly )

[Myroria]

I like that solution as well.

[Musitant]

Myroria's fix and Cormac's idea fix all the freedom of speech issues I had with this. Sounds great to me!

[Eluvatar]

Still doesn't go too far enough

(I kid)

[Allama]

Myroria's fix and Cormac's idea fix all the freedom of speech issues I had with this. Sounds great to me!

Agreed! I move that we bring the following to a vote.

A Resolution to Further the Cause of Egalitarianism and the Glorious Revolution by the Outlawing of Noble Houses

1. The government of Taijitu, when acting in an official capacity, will not recognize any noble house or any title therefrom derived, foreign or otherwise.
2. If a foreigner belonging to a noble house applies for citizenship, it shall be granted. However, the citizen will be referred to by the government of Taijitu, when acting in an official capacity, as "Citizen [name]", and no reference will be made to their counterrevolutionary pedigree.
3. If a foreigner belonging to a noble house is assigned here as a dignitary, or resides in Taijitu without acquiring citizenship, they shall be referred to by the government of Taijitu, when acting in an official capacity, by their name only, and no reference will be made to their counterrevolutionary pedigree.
4. Citizens and foreign residents are encouraged, but not required, to avoid personal use of noble names or titles in Taijitu, as a demonstration of respect for the egalitarian principles of the Glorious Revolution.