Taijitu
Forum Meta => May 2008 - Government of Taijitu => Government Archive => Archive => The Supreme Court => Topic started by: Sovereign Dixie on October 15, 2007, 03:36:17 AM
-
I TOOOOOOLLLLD YOUUUUUU SOOOOOOO.....
-
?
-
?
SD's pointing out that he was saying Govinda was a danger to the region before any of this started, and that back then no one was willing to listen.
-
Do not pass judgement yet...
Though its probably true.
-
Could be that he warned us that he was infected with a giant-red-typeface-posting-disease which has now manifested itself?
-
Wow.........
*Hands Dix the most annoying post ever award*
You've earned this.
-
Wow.........
*Hands Dix the most annoying post ever award*
You've earned this.
Don't worry I've seen worse
-
SD, you somehow always manage to make me giggle.
-
Is the flaming really necessary SD?
-
That's not flaming. Stop overreacting. He's stating his opinion.
-
That's not flaming. Stop overreacting. He's stating his opinion.
I consider it flaming - look how he addressed the topic. Complete disregard for civility or decency, and an automatic assumption that I'm guilty, before the trial even starts.
-
Complete disregard for civility or decency, and an automatic assumption that I'm guilty, before the trial even starts.
None of this was stated by Sovereign Dixie, whether you choose to believe what others infer from his post is your own choice.
Secondly, it is not flaming, he is entitled to his own view, although in a smaller font would be more pleasing to the eye.
-
Complete disregard for civility or decency, and an automatic assumption that I'm guilty, before the trial even starts.
None of this was stated by Sovereign Dixie, whether you choose to believe what others infer from his post is your own choice.
Secondly, it is not flaming, he is entitled to his own view, although in a smaller font would be more pleasing to the eye.
It is implied, through the manner of his posting, that it was designed to elicit a strong response. Given his past history of how rude he's been to me, I can see that this is done specifically for flamebait purposes
-
I agree with Govinda at some point! I still do not realise how much harm was, is and have to be done until the end of this petty fight. Bad image from the upside people, get it through for Opera's sake.
(EDIT: Modified format for everyone's convenience)
-
*takes the Most Annoying Post Ever Award from Dix and hands it to Delfos.*
Wow. I thought you were annoying before, but this is annoying on a whole new level.
-
Children, children... come now. I'm sure the justices would love it if we stop pirating their forum with useless posts.
-
I AGREE!
-
My post wasn't useless.
-
Delfos, get out of the Supreme Court subforums now.
Using a big font does not enhance your opinion, whatever you may think.
-
Getting back on track with this, Govindia is saying that he personally would prefer for the trial to take place on the forums.
He is also still as far as I know asking for Durnia to recuse himself as a Justice from the trial.
-
Govindia is saying that he personally would prefer for the trial to take place on the forums.
It is not for him to dictate terms.
-
Actually, seeing as how I'm unable to connect to the Tai IRC webclient (weird, isn't it) having part of the trial on the forums might not be a bad idea.
-
Govindia is saying that he personally would prefer for the trial to take place on the forums.
It is not for him to dictate terms.
11. The Supreme Court shall consist of no less than three Justices. Should a Justice be either the Prosecutor or the Defender or otherwise be significantly biased in a case, they shall recuse themselves during the trial from their role as Justice, and the remaining Justices shall select as many additional impartial panel members as are necessary to fulfill the requirements enumerated herein to serve as interim Justices for the duration of the trial.
The question is, does your history with Govindia provide grounds for a bias to exist? Certainly if the accused feels there is reason that such bias may exist the matter should be considered to keep the trial transparently fair and impartial. I'd ask that you consider this on your own instead of calling a senate review to investiagte your lack of bias in this matter.
Did Govindia mention why he feels this bias may exist Prag?
-
A lot of things have been said in the IRC channel that might give Gov that impression. If the trial is conducted on the forum, out in the open, I think there would be much less doubt regarding the legitimacy of the ruling in the end, but that's for you justices to decide.
-
Since I can only post in the SC and nowhere else, I'll say what I have to say here.
I asked, through Pragmia, that Durnia recuse himself, because his personal opinions of me, as he's shown in IRC, have made me conclude that he cannot be impartial and fair, and would be biased towards me in any regard. His recent actions in TNP also have made it more clear of a conflict of interest.
I believe I have the right to request how I want the trial conducted. If its on the forum, it's out in the open, and I want it that way. Not to mention that I do not have access to IRC at work, where I have limited access as it already is. I do not have access to IRC at home until I get Internet is installed, and that is dependent on the availability of the local techs here in my state.
Forcing it in IRC would not make it open, as not everyone has the ability to get on IRC (as in the case of myself).
-
His recent actions in TNP also have made it more clear of a conflict of interest.
I think my efficient, quick and effective distribution of justice in The North Pacific right now, shows my skills as a Supreme Court Judge actually.
-
Care to explain? ???
-
Okay, there's been a petition for a Justice to recuse, and that Justice has refused to recuse. This means that the other Justices now must decide whether or not to force a recusal. I cite the Judiciary Act:
12. Either side in the trial may object to the selection of an interim Justice or a Justice's failure to recuse themselves and the remaining Justices may then by a two thirds vote remove or force the recusal of that Justice.
Eluvatar, Khablan, Durnia, to the Back Room and the IRC channel, if you please.
-
I have recused myself from the case.
-
I was under the impression Khablan would not be sitting on this case as a justice since she was confirmed only after the docket was brought to court?
If that is not the case, than I request, through Pragmia, that Khablan also recuse herself from this case, and that justices that are viewed by BOTH sides as fair and impartial are temporarily appointed to replace both.
-
Care to explain? ???
Osa, check the TNP embassy, or their forum
-
I was under the impression Khablan would not be sitting on this case as a justice since she was confirmed only after the docket was brought to court?
If that is not the case, than I request, through Pragmia, that Khablan also recuse herself from this case, and that justices that are viewed by BOTH sides as fair and impartial are temporarily appointed to replace both.
Translation, you want to stack the court with people who will find you innocent. If you've made such a mess of your stay here that even the Justices can't stand you, what does that say?
-
That the Justices lack infinite patience? O:-)
-
I was under the impression Khablan would not be sitting on this case as a justice since she was confirmed only after the docket was brought to court?
If that is not the case, than I request, through Pragmia, that Khablan also recuse herself from this case, and that justices that are viewed by BOTH sides as fair and impartial are temporarily appointed to replace both.
Translation, you want to stack the court with people who will find you innocent. If you've made such a mess of your stay here that even the Justices can't stand you, what does that say?
I never said that. I only want impartial justices. I can't even see what evidence was present yet.
-
If you can find someone who doesn't like you, then wow.
-
I was under the impression Khablan would not be sitting on this case as a justice since she was confirmed only after the docket was brought to court?
If that is not the case, than I request, through Pragmia, that Khablan also recuse herself from this case, and that justices that are viewed by BOTH sides as fair and impartial are temporarily appointed to replace both.
Translation, you want to stack the court with people who will find you innocent. If you've made such a mess of your stay here that even the Justices can't stand you, what does that say?
Interesting: that was my take on this newest request too. Wonder what Eluvatar thinks...
-
If you can find someone who doesn't like you, then wow.
You know, I'm pretty much ambivalent towards Govindia. I really don't care one way or the other, since all I know about him is what he looks like (from the Pictures thread). I know I'm not even a Senator anymore, and I'm not sure what the full rules are for this, but, if I qualify, I'm open.
Two issues, though...I am not able to access the IRC (for some strange reason), and I won't have computer access until next Monday. However, at the rate this trial is going, that might be fine.
-
If indeed another Justice becomes necessary, I will offer my services as such. If not, best of luck to all involved.
-
I believe I have the right to request how I want the trial conducted.
I personally believe that you cannot request how the trial is to be conducted. You can but make a request that can be approved or denied.
If you cannot access IRC then the trial can be conducted in here, although an IRC trial would have been far more operative.
This is a Court procedure and citizens will have access to the public statement once the case is over. The transparency of the judicial act doesn't mean that it would need to be conducted in plain view. We are not conducting public trials, as far as I know. I personally do not have a problem with it. I also strongly protest against Govindia's attempts to discredit the Judges of Taijitu. If Durnia has recused himself in order to speed the process, Khablan has been one of the Taijituans who has showed you the most understanding. I don't think that she (or Durnia for that matter) is not able to judge based upon evidence and be objective, as you are implying.
I urge the esteemed Court to regulate the proceedings and get this trial underway, the poisoning of the atmosphere here in Taijitu by this malicious persona shouldn't be allowed to go on.
-
it is not for you to appoint justices, or to veto their appointment. That is the domain of the delegate and the Senate. For you to attempt to do so is greatly to overstep the rights of a defendant in this or any other case.
Everyone has personal opinions in life. The fact that certain individuals are appointed as justices means that the region trusts them to put personal opinions to one side and judge fairly and impartially. I feel that a judge should recuse themselves only when they have material involvement in the case, not because the prosecution or defence feels they have "personal opinions". If a judge cannot put personal opinions to one side, they should not be on the bench, period. I believe all our justices (including Durnia) to be capable of dispensing justice well and fairly.
I hardly need to add that during my last few days as delegate I will not be appointing any judges to pander to the whim of a defendant.
-
Already one justice has recused themselves though, so a replacement will need to be done at least for the, for this trial.
-
Well, we still have 3 confirmed Justices Govindia, the minimum number needed to hold a trial. I personally suggest that you take those three so that this thing can get underway.
-
If i can help, i would stand in as Justice for this trial as I've missed this whole episode so believe i have no bias as long as i qualify.
-
If i can help, i would stand in as Justice for this trial as I've missed this whole episode so believe i have no bias as long as i qualify.
I don't think that'll be necessary....
Well, we still have 3 confirmed Justices Govindia, the minimum number needed to hold a trial. I personally suggest that you take those three so that this thing can get underway.
-
In my opinion the power to recuse a Justice for bias should only be necessary if maybe I was a Justice in Govindia's case. I've been more prejudicial and biased towards him than basically anyone else on this Forum. Durnia in my opinion was a good choice but you traded him in for Khab. If you recuse again I feel the Justices might appoint myself as a substitute just to smite you. Hell Govindia, I don't even know why you bother with this trial... Even if you did win why would you go back to a place where more than half of the people despise you. The evidence may or may not pin you as a criminal but you will always be a Forum Crasher. I've never in my 3 years of NS playing seen such a disturbing figure in a region. The fact that a large group of people went out of their ways to send you to trial is another thing and now you act as if you want to control the whole place. Govindia, there's a point to which you argue your rights of Democracy to just being a little brat that cries for candy at the grocery store. I don't know if you've noticed but we're not under the Constitution of America or the Constitution of Govindia, so stop your grievances and endless taunts, rants, flames, whining, bratting, ganking, and downright bitching. Just face the evidence, face the court, and face the decision already. I think everyone in this region including myself are capable of not contributing their bias in any case. However if I do see someone contribute bias in their case I might get a little angry about, I might choke... you never know!
-
Can you guys just frickin' start the trial so we can get Baltija unbanned?
-
I've been more prejudicial and biased towards him than basically anyone else on this Forum.
Again, I want to remind you, you're all posers. I hated Govindia before it was cool O:-)
-
Well there are new things that complicate stuff further.
1. Pragmia is elected Delegate. Congrats to him, but that means he's no longer my defence councel
2. OT, my co-defence councel, hasn't been around throughout the lifetime of this thread, from what I have seen.
That being said, I'm not sure what happens now at this point.
1. Will my trial be on the forum as I have requested?
2. Since I really don't have any available defence councel, I would like to request someone new to be my defence councel. Who is willing to do this, be it out of principle or whatever else?
-
I'd love to, but I don't have the time unless the proceedings start next Thursday, earliest.
-
Well there are new things that complicate stuff further.
1. Pragmia is elected Delegate. Congrats to him, but that means he's no longer my defence councel
2. OT, my co-defence councel, hasn't been around throughout the lifetime of this thread, from what I have seen.
That being said, I'm not sure what happens now at this point.
1. Will my trial be on the forum as I have requested?
2. Since I really don't have any available defence councel, I would like to request someone new to be my defence councel. Who is willing to do this, be it out of principle or whatever else?
I will help as defense council, either alone or as a co-council. Partly out of principle and partly to see justice done and partly because i think you have a strong case.
-
Well there are new things that complicate stuff further.
1. Pragmia is elected Delegate. Congrats to him, but that means he's no longer my defence councel
2. OT, my co-defence councel, hasn't been around throughout the lifetime of this thread, from what I have seen.
That being said, I'm not sure what happens now at this point.
1. Will my trial be on the forum as I have requested?
2. Since I really don't have any available defence councel, I would like to request someone new to be my defence councel. Who is willing to do this, be it out of principle or whatever else?
i was only informed of this thread today, and besides i thought you chose Prag as your sole defence council and ive got my own trial coming up IRL
-
Well there are new things that complicate stuff further.
1. Pragmia is elected Delegate. Congrats to him, but that means he's no longer my defence councel (sic)
I do not understand why this needs to be the case. There is nothing I see in our laws that precludes this.
-
Flem, please, what would you know about the law?
-
ouch.
-
Heh....ahem.
I can see only one problem with Pragmia being your defence counsel, and that is the fact that this is Taijitu vs, Govindia, but I am sure Prag can do a wonderful job nonetheless.
I would respectfully ask the Court to appoint a presiding Judge who shall set-up the framework for this trial, award the defendant a limited amount of time in which to aquire a new counsel (if necessary) and allow us to start and finish this trial.
We are faced here with a personality that has plagued more than a few regions across NationStates, where he has been banned from without so many second thoughts and ulterior motivations. This is a case that goes beyond the set-up rules of our community, a trial against a persona famous for the troubles caused and the lack of perspective for his latter integration. I personally am tired of wasting my time on an ever-lasting cat-mouse game and I suspect that the majority of Taijitu believes the same. Please, let us get it over with.
-
We are faced here with a personality that has plagued more than a few regions across NationStates, where he has been banned from without so many second thoughts and ulterior motivations. This is a case that goes beyond the set-up rules of our community, a trial against a persona famous for the troubles caused and the lack of perspective for his latter integration. I personally am tired of wasting my time on an ever-lasting cat-mouse game and I suspect that the majority of Taijitu believes the same. Please, let us get it over with.
Get your facts straight please. I have been banned from SOME regions yes, but it is NOT in the dozens, as many outlandishly claim. Is there a lack of perspective given towards how people have judged me? Possibly.
That aside,
I would humbly ask to have the following as my defence councel, if they are all willing:
Soly, Templarios, and Allama.
I would like to remind the court that my time is limited on the Internet, and I cannot view IRC at work. the firewall here specifically blocks any and all chat programmes, and anything that runs Java, ActiveX, or JavaScript. I have made a formal request, which also I believe has been put forth by my former councel, Pragmia, to have this trial done over the forum.
-
We are faced here with a personality that has plagued more than a few regions across NationStates, where he has been banned from without so many second thoughts and ulterior motivations. This is a case that goes beyond the set-up rules of our community, a trial against a persona famous for the troubles caused and the lack of perspective for his latter integration. I personally am tired of wasting my time on an ever-lasting cat-mouse game and I suspect that the majority of Taijitu believes the same. Please, let us get it over with.
Get your facts straight please. I have been banned from SOME regions yes, but it is NOT in the dozens, as many outlandishly claim. Is there a lack of perspective given towards how people have judged me? Possibly.
That aside,
I would humbly ask to have the following as my defence councel, if they are all willing:
Soly, Templarios, and Allama.
I would like to remind the court that my time is limited on the Internet, and I cannot view IRC at work. the firewall here specifically blocks any and all chat programmes, and anything that runs Java, ActiveX, or JavaScript. I have made a formal request, which also I believe has been put forth by my former councel, Pragmia, to have this trial done over the forum.
I am willing and the court to form as soon as possible. I also ask for the trail to be held on the forum in a special thread for records and so a fair process can by carried out.
-
I agree with PoD, this person is a blight upon NS, I've tried telling ppl this over and over, but no one would listen until it got to this point, and still it's allowed to drag on. Just get rid of him for fucks sake, every day he's still around
A) is annoying
b) makes us look like a bunch of inept idiots
-
I agree with PoD, this person is a blight upon NS, I've tried telling ppl this over and over, but no one would listen until it got to this point, and still it's allowed to drag on. Just get rid of him for fucks sake, every day he's still around
A) is annoying
b) makes us look like a bunch of inept idiots
Irony!
Anyway, I'll hold my decision to accept or not until the eighth of November.
-
Since I really don't have any available defence councel, I would like to request someone new to be my defence councel. Who is willing to do this, be it out of principle or whatever else?
I'd love to represent you Gov!
Lol at Flem.
-
Since I really don't have any available defence councel, I would like to request someone new to be my defence councel. Who is willing to do this, be it out of principle or whatever else?
I'd love to represent you Gov!
Lol at Flem.
You are serious, yes?
-
I agree with PoD, this person is a blight upon NS, I've tried telling ppl this over and over, but no one would listen until it got to this point, and still it's allowed to drag on. Just get rid of him for fucks sake, every day he's still around
A) is annoying
b) makes us look like a bunch of inept idiots
And you're entitled to your personal opinion, even though it's never civil in nature.
-
Since I really don't have any available defence councel, I would like to request someone new to be my defence councel. Who is willing to do this, be it out of principle or whatever else?
I'd love to represent you Gov!
Lol at Flem.
You are serious, yes?
I think its a joke...
-
Irony!
Sarcasm!
-
Since I really don't have any available defence councel, I would like to request someone new to be my defence councel. Who is willing to do this, be it out of principle or whatever else?
I'd love to represent you Gov!
Lol at Flem.
i'll wait for confirmation :P.
What's the best way to contact you outside forums?
You are serious, yes?
I think its a joke...
-
Please keep things leveled in the sub-forums of the Court.
Get your facts straight please. I have been banned from SOME regions yes, but it is NOT in the dozens, as many outlandishly claim. Is there a lack of perspective given towards how people have judged me? Possibly.
I work only with straight facts. I have never spoken about dozens of regions, learn to read or understand, I have no idea which of the two capacities is failing you.
We all have limited Internet time, do not forget that this Court has waited a week for the defendant to show up, at a time when we were all present. You have joined #taijitu last week from a different IP (actually, you are in IRC in multiple channels at this very moment, I wonder what explanation you will give us since you constantly appear in IRC after 1 am East Coast and you said that you have no Internet at home, I guess you are in the habit of sleeping in Internet-Cafés), am not about to accuse you of trying to avoid an IRC trial (however when this Court is in session I will do my best to push for an IRC trial as I will not lose weeks of this), but please get a counsel and let us move on. It is not our responsibility to provide you with a counsel. I suppose you could defend yourself, that way you would be sure that you want nothing but your best.
And why does Soly want to wait till my birthday? ;)
-
If I really must be Gov's counsel then I will be. I really, really would like to see this done and finished.
-
Why IRC?
What's so wrong in keeping this to the forum? Not everyone can access IRC when you can, and unless you do not want it public, which it should be, I see no reason it cannot be in this forum. The trial must be public, where everyone will have a chance to see.
The only reason I've been on a few times the past late evenings is I'm in places where its wifi accessible publicly. It's 1 am maybe in the east coast at that time, but here it would be 10 pm pacific coast - yes that's right, i have moved across the country in case you did not notice.
So far only one has accepted the offer on councel, one is considering it, and I have not heard from the third (Allama). I hope to hear response from the other two soon.
-
Why IRC?
Gov, it's a lot faster. A lot.
-
I unfortunately do not have access to IRC at the times GMT is available though - work firewall blocks it.
So right now, I am waiting to hear from the justices on this part if it can be done through the forum or not.
Secondly, I would like to formally request that Templarios, Pragmia (if its allowed), and if possibly, Soly to be my defence councel team. If Soly does accept, the trial may be needing to put on hold until 8 Nov. as per his availability.
If the court cannot wait until then, I would like my councel to be Templarios and (if allowed again), Pragmia.
-
I can just jump in, anyway. Also, if there is real necessity for haste, the trial could be done via proxy.
-
Why not prosecution statement get done now? We don't need a defense team for that - gets the ball rolling?
-
I can just jump in, anyway. Also, if there is real necessity for haste, the trial could be done via proxy.
Via proxy ? How?
-
I can just jump in, anyway. Also, if there is real necessity for haste, the trial could be done via proxy.
Via proxy ? How?
You aren't there, you are 'represented' by a person/group of people - basically.
-
I'm seriously starting to consider proposing that the Delegate can just ban people if the clear will of the people are for it, following in TAO's wise banning of Govindia in The West Pacific. (http://twp.nosync.org/index.php?showtopic=4224)
-
OMG just get to it plz.
-
I'm seriously starting to consider proposing that the Delegate can just ban people if the clear will of the people are for it, following in TAO's wise banning of Govindia in The West Pacific. (http://twp.nosync.org/index.php?showtopic=4224)
Good thing you were tried for treason in TNP and you recused yourself here.
-
Why not prosecution statement get done now? We don't need a defense team for that - gets the ball rolling?
Can this happen to get started. Once that is done, the defense can make their statement in response to what the prosecution say. We can always go from there.
-
Quoting yourself? :D
Please leave the proceedings of this trial to the Court, Templarios. If you are an official counsel to Govindia I want that clearly stated.
We are in IRC at the same time a lot (for example NOW, again. the last time was....hmmm....let me think...ah yes! yesterday). I do not intend to waste any more time. As far as I am concerned this trial will not be a public one, if the Judges decide otherwise, so be it. The 'public' will be given access to all evidence and be given a statement, but judging by the way how, although it was asked more than once to not interfere with the proceedings and not post randomly in the Court, Citizens ignore any requests of the Judges, I think that policing the spectators and deleting posts from the thread is not what we are here to do. Should this trial be public, it is much easier to have a spectator that is not able to speak, but can witness the proceedings. Those who have no access to IRC will be able to request a transcript of the trial.
-
Templarios is my official councel, and unless Soly or Pragmia confirms it, they as well.
This trial must be public on the forum, so everyone can view what's being said, and I trust Taijituan citizens to refrain themselves from interfering in court matters while any proceedings are underway.
-
i will confirm with my employer Mr. Soly for you.
-
The apathy party of Taijitu commends this trial for its lack of progress.
-
Good thing you were tried for treason in TNP and you recused yourself here.
I believe I gave out justice most efficiently, but I decided that I didn't want to waste my time on you.
-
Good thing you were tried for treason in TNP and you recused yourself here.
I believe I gave out justice most efficiently, but I decided that I didn't want to waste my time on you.
Can feel the love here!
-
I'm seriously starting to consider proposing that the Delegate can just ban people if the clear will of the people are for it, following in TAO's wise banning of Govindia in The West Pacific. (http://twp.nosync.org/index.php?showtopic=4224)
Good thing you were tried for treason in TNP and you recused yourself here.
Time for you to get your facts straight.
The group that founded Taijitu came from the Lex, and Durnia was one of those people. While we were all in the Lex he split time between us and TNP.
When we moved and founded Taijitu he simply split time between us (in a new region) and TNP. He never recused himself here, this was always one of his NS "homes."
You would seem to be the one who's using Taijitu to hide, and we look even more idiotic each day we waste by not getting this over with.
Furthermore, SD's attacks on you have been just. A tad obnoxious, but just. He seems more prophetic each time you post.
To the court, just give the baby his bottle, and hold the trial on the forums. Anything to move this circus along....
-
I'm seriously starting to consider proposing that the Delegate can just ban people if the clear will of the people are for it, following in TAO's wise banning of Govindia in The West Pacific. (http://twp.nosync.org/index.php?showtopic=4224)
Good thing you were tried for treason in TNP and you recused yourself here.
Time for you to get your facts straight.
The group that founded Taijitu came from the Lex, and Durnia was one of those people. While we were all in the Lex he split time between us and TNP.
When we moved and founded Taijitu he simply split time between us (in a new region) and TNP. He never recused himself here, this was always one of his NS "homes."
You would seem to be the one who's using Taijitu to hide, and we look even more idiotic each day we waste by not getting this over with.
Furthermore, SD's attacks on you have been just. A tad obnoxious, but just. He seems more prophetic each time you post.
To the court, just give the baby his bottle, and hold the trial on the forums. Anything to move this circus along....
I think Govinda was referring to Durnia's recusing himself from this case.
-
The apathy party of Taijitu commends this trial for its lack of progress.
Best apathy party post yet.
-
I shall not be acting as Gov's defence counsel.
-
What is happening with this trial?
-
As of right now, it would appear as though what's going on is... hmmm, nothing.
Unless, of course, "delays" count as something.
-
What do you mean and who starts the trial?
-
To the best of my knowledge, the trial would have to start sometime after the 13th. That is when one of the justices would be available, as he has schoolwork to do before then.
Given that Soly is unable to act as defence councel, I still would like to retain Templarios as my councel for this case.
-
If it means getting this damn trial started, I will volunteer to be Gov's council or a temporary justice, what ever's needed. Let's just get this thing underway already!
-
Yeah, this seriously needs to get rolling and be done with, if you need an interim justice I'll gladly step up.
-
so public opinion: just get it over with already!
-
And who is the prosecution?
-
This is a general announcement, there is no need for any more justices or councilors, we are being held up by Govindia and another judge, but constant comments etc are not helpful.
That is all.
-
This is a general announcement, there is no need for any more justices or councilors, we are being held up by Govindia and another judge, but constant comments etc are not helpful.
That is all.
Sorry, in what way are being held up by Govindia? As his defense council i think i have a right to post here.
-
First off, the judges are set. Govindia's defense team is not. I've been in contact with him today to rectify that situation and try to schedule the actual trial. That is the only holdup right now. The people are right, this has gone on far too long already. It is my intention to kick this thing into gear. You can bet the house on that.
-
After chatting with Gov last night, I've decided to be one of his counselors. Also, Gov says he has his internet back and can access irc now. However, I and the other counsel , Templarios, are unable to get on irc. For this reason, we're wanting a trial on the forum. While Gov may be able to get on irc now, the rest of the defense is unable to. Since nobody else seems willing to be his counsel, and it would be incredibaly unjust to make Gov have to defend himself, there's simply no other way to do it.
Let me check with Gov first, but I'm almost positive that the trial can begin at any time if we're granted one by forum.
-
After chatting with Gov last night, I've decided to be one of his counselors. Also, Gov says he has his internet back and can access irc now. However, I and the other counsel , Templarios, are unable to get on irc. For this reason, we're wanting a trial on the forum. While Gov may be able to get on irc now, the rest of the defense is unable to. Since nobody else seems willing to be his counsel, and it would be incredibaly unjust to make Gov have to defend himself, there's simply no other way to do it.
Let me check with Gov first, but I'm almost positive that the trial can begin at any time if we're granted one by forum.
I would also like to add that Pragmia has agreed to be co-councel as well,so we have for my defence co-councel as Templarios, Osafune, and Pragmia.
Some people do not understand why I apparently seem to be the problem causing the delay.
I'll be frank. The times I was on IRC were in fleeting moments last month, mooching off of someone's wireless, but otherwise I was without Internet at home, as I did not get the service finally until Halloween, five weeks after I initially ordered it. Yea Charter isn't the best here but it's all I got. In the meantime, all my Internet access is limited at work, and I cannot use IRC with this company's firewall.
I hope this clears up things.
-
Co-counsel? I only agreed on the conditions that there was absolutely no one else available, which does not seem to be the case here.
-
So, whats happerning then?
-
omg just get on with it.
-
The Apathy Party of Taijitu presents this special award to the govindian-defence-counsel-formation-pratting-about-team.
(http://www.normansaunders.com/Kooky/67-00%2CKooky-30.jpg)
-
Co-counsel? I only agreed on the conditions that there was absolutely no one else available, which does not seem to be the case here.
Ignoring the flame by Flemingovia's party, I misinterpreted. Osafune and Templarios will be my councel then.
From what I have talked about with two justices, it seems the trial will occur after the 13th.
To Meri:
Patience is a virtue, young padawan. I was without Internet for a month. Surely if you were in the same situation you would not like people jumping down with more impatience than even a n00b in Halo or Counter-Strike can muster.
-
I've been chosen to be a witness by Gov.
-
I've been chosen to be a witness by Gov.
Thank you, can you message me with the general gist of what your going to say as a witness. Will be kept confidential.
-
To Meri:
Patience is a virtue, young padawan. I was without Internet for a month. Surely if you were in the same situation you would not like people jumping down with more impatience than even a n00b in Halo or Counter-Strike can muster.
This region has shown you more patients then it should have. You're the sole reason none of this is moving forward. You're trying to dictate terms to the Justices. You're playing cat and mouse with your defence team. Just cut out the crap, let the trial move forward, and answer the accusations brought against you. If you're innocent, you'll get off. If you're guilty, you're gone. Simple as that.
Only in Taijitu could something this simple be so complicated.
-
Removing Pragmia from your defence time = suicidal.
-
I don't think he his removing him, Prag was only going to be defense is no1 else would stand. Also, you saying as an 'imparal' justice that Gov has lost the trial before it has even started???
-
Who said I was impartial.
-
being a justice?
-
Durnia recused himself; he speaks of this case not as a Justice, but as a Citizen.
-
Well, what about the repeated snide and just plain bitter comments. Surely they should be stopped as they serve no benefit and just generally pointless.
-
Gov told me on IRC that the prosecution and defense may each desire to call upon me as a witness, but neither team has contacted me in regards to what they would like to ask or have me speak about. I welcome any messages you would like to send my way, guys.
Secondly, if the following is accurate...
While this date is not yet final, it is my understanding that this trial will occur Friday November the 16th in #court on esper.net, beginning late that evening by GMT time.
..I may not be able to participate in the live trial regardless (as I leave work shortly after 20:00 GMT, I believe). Would it be it permissible to, perhaps, prepare a statement in advance to be issued by one team or another on my behalf?
-
Well, what about the repeated snide and just plain bitter comments. Surely they should be stopped as they serve no benefit and just generally pointless.
Everything I say is beneficial.
-
please can you demonstrate that point.
-
I could, yes.
-
Gov told me on IRC that the prosecution and defense may each desire to call upon me as a witness, but neither team has contacted me in regards to what they would like to ask or have me speak about. I welcome any messages you would like to send my way, guys.
Secondly, if the following is accurate...
While this date is not yet final, it is my understanding that this trial will occur Friday November the 16th in #court on esper.net, beginning late that evening by GMT time.
..I may not be able to participate in the live trial regardless (as I leave work shortly after 20:00 GMT, I believe). Would it be it permissible to, perhaps, prepare a statement in advance to be issued by one team or another on my behalf?
Yes.
Preferably, allow each to interview you.
-
I could, yes.
Waiting...
and you do know its children in need night that evening in the UK...
-
I could, yes.
Waiting...
and you do know its children in need night that evening in the UK...
Excuse me?
-
wait, whats going on?
-
Long story, read and enjoy...
-
too lazy to
-
Your loss
-
Preferably, allow each to interview you.
This would be a more than acceptable solution in my mind. ^_^ I hereby request that both the prosecution and defense gain testimony from me directly via interview as suggested (if they both remain interested in my words), preferably via IRC. I have spoken to both PoD Gunner and Templarios there in the past couple days, so you're likely both aware of my availability. Work should die down sufficiently to allow me to join the channel fairly shortly, in fact, and I plan to remain there for a few hours.
-
Preferably, allow each to interview you.
This would be a more than acceptable solution in my mind. ^_^ I hereby request that both the prosecution and defense gain testimony from me directly via interview as suggested (if they both remain interested in my words), preferably via IRC. I have spoken to both PoD Gunner and Templarios there in the past couple days, so you're likely both aware of my availability. Work should die down sufficiently to allow me to join the channel fairly shortly, in fact, and I plan to remain there for a few hours.
Thank you, some one will communicate with you soon.
-
really though, why is govndia the bad guy here?
-
really though, why is govndia the bad guy here?
Because there is some 'evidence' that none of us have seen yet which says he did/is trying/is planning to do something against Taijitu...
-
but gov seems like a nice guy....
-
Some people dont think so
-
BAsed on Govindia's latest post in the trial thread, it seems to me that this is a rather arse-about-face way of running a trial.
I would have thought that the court would schedule the trial, and the defendant would need to appoint counsel who could attend the trial at the time and the place set by the court, not say "I'm sorry, my defence team cannot be on IRC, so the trial will have to be on the forum...
It has been known for ages that the trial would be on IRC. Why has he appointed counsel who cannot attend the trial, unless the aim is to delay or derail?
-
At this point I have to agree with Flem. It was known from the beginning that this would be an IRC trial and Gov had council that could make it on IRC, yet he chose to remove them from the defense team. Now he appoints council that can't. If I were on trial I believe one of the first questions I'd ask any possible defense team members would be "Can you be available and have the ability to make it on IRC?". That's just me though. Maybe I'm crazy for that. :shrug:
Edit: Said I instead of It in the second sentence. >_>
-
Well for one thing, I volunteered to be his counsel. Do you see anyone else stepping up?
I believe the defense has a right to a forum trial. There's no law that says it has to be on irc.
-
I believe the defense has a right to a forum trial.
Why? On what basis does this right exist?
-
I believe the defense has a right to a forum trial. There's no law that says it has to be on irc.
That and the few people willing to be his counsel don't have access, or will find it hard to get it.
-
You are mistaken. He had council that had access to IRC, but he decided to switch the people.
-
No, you have just switched from saying it is a right, to that there is no law against it.
That and the few people willing to be his counsel don't have access
I believe Gov has removed a number of people who could have been his counsel. Also, if he is sufficiently disliked that he finds it difficult to find a counsel, he could always request that one be appointed for him.
-
BAsed on Govindia's latest post in the trial thread, it seems to me that this is a rather arse-about-face way of running a trial.
I would have thought that the court would schedule the trial, and the defendant would need to appoint counsel who could attend the trial at the time and the place set by the court, not say "I'm sorry, my defence team cannot be on IRC, so the trial will have to be on the forum...
It has been known for ages that the trial would be on IRC. Why has he appointed counsel who cannot attend the trial, unless the aim is to delay or derail?
No, it wasn't. it was first discussed as IRC vs. forum. You can't have a fair trial by forcing me to go on IRC when my defence councel cannot be able to attend for very legitimate reasons. It is not stated in the law that the trial HAS to be on IRC.
-
I believe the defense has a right to a forum trial.
Why? On what basis does this right exist?
Lets switch the question - on what basis does it have to be a on IRC? What right do they have?
-
I believe the defense has a right to a forum trial.
Why? On what basis does this right exist?
The defendant certainly has the right to a trial, and his defense can't access IRC. That leaves at least three choices:
1. Drop the charges
2. Delay until Gov has a team that CAN access IRC (so much for speedy trials)
3. Have a forum trial.
My personal preference would be #3, not that my opinion is particularly relevant.
-
It doesn't take that long to find a defense team...
Seriously, the Bench and the Government are ready, and have been ready, to conduct a trial. A majority of the Justices are in favor of holding the trial on IRC, and this has been known for at least a week by both the Government and the Defendant. And, unless I am quite mistaken, it is for the Bench to decide what its procedures for conducting a trial will be.
-
The defendant certainly has the right to a trial, and his defense can't access IRC. That leaves at least three choices:
1. Drop the charges
2. Delay until Gov has a team that CAN access IRC (so much for speedy trials)
3. Have a forum trial.
I can think of at least three other options:
4. Govindia represents himself. I mean, this is hardly the OJ Simpson trial, why does Govindia need a "team".
5. since Govindia is unable to appoint counsel who can attend the court hearings, the court appoint counsel for him.
6. The court accepts that it's chain is being jerked, and it sets a time and place for the trial, informs the defendant and goes ahead. If the defendent or his counsel cannot make it, the trial continues in absentia, and everyone accepts that the court bent over backwards to accommodate Govindia, but a line had to be drawn somewhere.
-
The defendant certainly has the right to a trial, and his defense can't access IRC. That leaves at least three choices:
1. Drop the charges
2. Delay until Gov has a team that CAN access IRC (so much for speedy trials)
3. Have a forum trial.
I can think of at least three other options:
4. Govindia represents himself. I mean, this is hardly the OJ Simpson trial, why does Govindia need a "team".
5. since Govindia is unable to appoint counsel who can attend the court hearings, the court appoint counsel for him.
6. The court accepts that it's chain is being jerked, and it sets a time and place for the trial, informs the defendant and goes ahead. If the defendent or his counsel cannot make it, the trial continues in absentia, and everyone accepts that the court bent over backwards to accommodate Govindia, but a line had to be drawn somewhere.
I like option 6 personally
-
a speedy trial can be done on the forum as well, and reduce clutter as opposed to IRC trials.
Denying my councel the right to represent me would show bias against the defence.
I have made it emphatically clear here, in case people can't realise, what happened to my past councel and why Prag and OT had to drop. I didn't force them to do anything. I also explained how I have been through most of Oct. without internet access at home for valid reasons.
There is nothing wrong with a forum trial, unless someone is afraid of public transparency, or a fair trial, or something else.....
-
a speedy trial can be done on the forum as well, and reduce clutter as opposed to IRC trials.
With all due respect, it cannot. The continued bickering over trial setting is proof of this.
Denying my councel the right to represent me would show bias against the defence.
I fail to see this. In RL, if a council does not make it to the trial along with the defendant, then either that council is replaced (especially if that council is court appointed in the first place) or the trial is postponed. So far, the Court has been postponing the trial indefinately, and while there are not as yet serious discussions among the Justices as to appointing a defense team for you, the thought has been circling my brain for some days now.
I have made it emphatically clear here, in case people can't realise, what happened to my past councel and why Prag and OT had to drop. I didn't force them to do anything. I also explained how I have been through most of Oct. without internet access at home for valid reasons.
If you spent October without internet access at home, you wouldn't have been able to access the forum from home either. This is not an argument in favor of a forum trial; this is an argument to prove that you need council. And you do. Whether or not you need these specific council, Templarios and Osmafune, is the issue in dispute. I believe, and from the looks of things, the other Justices agree, that you can be just as well-represented by others.
There is nothing wrong with a forum trial, unless someone is afraid of public transparency, or a fair trial, or something else.....
I know it's my job to read and to know the Constitution, but really, if you're going to make a Constitutional argument, please know what it says and how the Court has interpreted what it says in the past. The Court has said that the clause mandating disclosure of trial transcripts applies only when the trial is complete, and does not say that the court proceedings must be open to the public as they occur.
-
That's not flaming. Stop overreacting. He's stating his opinion.
I consider it flaming - look how he addressed the topic. Complete disregard for civility or decency, and an automatic assumption that I'm guilty, before the trial even starts.
Where have I heard all this before? :shrug:
-
4. Govindia represents himself. I mean, this is hardly the OJ Simpson trial, why does Govindia need a "team".
This is the one thing I don't agree with. He needs at least someone with experience to represent him in court, and I personally see no problem with him having a "team" so long as it is not excessive.
But I do fail to see how the Court is being as biased as Gov thinks it is. In general, Taijitu is unfortunately extremely biased against Gov, but the Court is being very liberal about following your requests. It just asks in return that you do the trial on IRC, and yes, you can clearly access IRC if you can access the forum.
-
Just a note, the defense is still waiting for access to the 'evidence' that started this all off... it has yet to be seen
-
Due note Myro, that due to work firewalls, that just because one may be able to access the forum, does NOT mean they can access IRC at work. My work firewall (as I have stated before) blocks any site that has ActiveX, JavaScript, or Java content. That includes PJIRC.
-
Just a note, the defense is still waiting for access to the 'evidence' that started this all off... it has yet to be seen
The trial is the proper place to present evidence, unless I'm totally missing something...
-
Just a note, the defense is still waiting for access to the 'evidence' that started this all off... it has yet to be seen
The trial is the proper place to present evidence, unless I'm totally missing something...
Then how are we to prepare our defense against it? If its on IRC - a few seconds?
-
I believe I miscontrued your statement. I thought you meant that the Government's evidence should be made public before the trial begins. Obviously I was mistaken.
-
I believe I miscontrued your statement. I thought you meant that the Government's evidence should be made public before the trial begins. Obviously I was mistaken.
It doesnt have to be, thats for the court to decide. An easy mistake to make. I meant that the defense team and Gov (in total confidence) should be allowed to see the evidence that started this all off. Is that possible?
-
It is certainly possible.
-
Thank you, when will it become available to us?
-
When a majority of the Justices say it will.
-
When a majority of the Justices say it will.
Thank you. If we don't get access to it before the trial - we will get access to it in the trial?
-
Is this still not started? Are we assuming that the primary aim of this trial is to see which counsel outlives the other? It's time for the court to step up and dictate terms for this trial - non-negotiable terms or this will still be going in a years time.
-
Hear, Hear!
-
I keep saying this: it is not the court's responsibility to wipe the bum of the defence team. If Govindia cannot even appoint defence counsel who can attend the court hearing, he deserves to go down.
For God's sake, set a time, set a date, set a venue and just hold the trial. Pragmia: You are the delegate. Don't just sit there saying "it seems nothing will happen" - make something happen.
If current justices recuse themselves or absent themselves, appoint some more who will get this thing done. We are in danger of becoming a laughingstock. :-[
-
I keep saying this: it is not the court's responsibility to wipe the bum of the defence team. If Govindia cannot even appoint defence counsel who can attend the court hearing, he deserves to go down.
For God's sake, set a time, set a date, set a venue and just hold the trial. Pragmia: You are the delegate. Don't just sit there saying "it seems nothing will happen" - make something happen.
If current justices recuse themselves or absent themselves, appoint some more who will get this thing done. We are in danger of becoming a laughingstock. :-[
I do agree with you but im gd with the bum thing
-
I keep saying this: it is not the court's responsibility to wipe the bum of the defence team. If Govindia cannot even appoint defence counsel who can attend the court hearing, he deserves to go down.
For God's sake, set a time, set a date, set a venue and just hold the trial. Pragmia: You are the delegate. Don't just sit there saying "it seems nothing will happen" - make something happen.
If current justices recuse themselves or absent themselves, appoint some more who will get this thing done. We are in danger of becoming a laughingstock. :-[
I'm sorry, but no. There is NOTHING in current law that states I must appoint councel to fit a set criteria for a few unpatient people. You are NOT the court, Flem. I am innocent until PROVEN guilty, and as such, I have a right to trial, which I have requested, and I have councel ready.
People somehow seem afraid of the forum, as if people are not going to be active. Osafune, myself, and Temp check the forum daily and post on it each week. I think that level of activity already proves such paranoid thinking wrong.
So with that said, My defence team and I are ready for this blasted trial. Let it occur on the forum and stop the incessant whining, paranoia, and protests, etc.
-
Govindia - Perhaps you should be slightly more respectful to the court. It is the court who decide how this trial will be conducted. A real life courtroom wouldn't have it's ceilings raised so that a client could take a giraffe as a lawyer. This is no different. The court sets the terms, you meet them.
Justices, I urge you to make haste on this - particularly if for some reason you decide to change your mind and conduct on the forum - I may only have another 70 years left... You have the power. Use it.
-
Hm, yes. It is time for something to happen and for me to intervene.
First off, if Govindia wants to hold the trial on the forum, then let him. That it may drag out is not really a problem because:
A: Just trying to start this whole idiotic affair has taken long enough.
B: If it does drag on into perpetuity, then that really is only Gov's problem, not anyone else
And as to justices, seeing as Gallipoli-China appears to be the only one left, and seeing as everyone is expecting me to replace the one's missing, I suppose then I'll make my two choices (unless Durnia unrecuses himself.)
TGR has expressed willingness to help, and if he can, then he's in.
Beyond that, the pool of active members with the necessary experience who are not already on one side of this case or in my executive government is rather limited, but working with little I have there seems to be yourself for starts Flem. There is also Tacolicious, who has been around a decent portion of time and seems just as eager to end this whole affair once and for all.
Al' would also be nice, but I know she's been busy lately.
I want to see something started by this Saturday, else I may very well be forced to take matters into my own hands.
-
Eh, Prag, let's just go Illuminati here. Saves time, AND we get cool robes.
-
I would be willing to help if you need an extra body. I've been around for just over a month, and that's not long enough to have a bias, is it? And honestly, I didn't know much about who Govindia even was until all of this started. It could be a temporary thing just to fill in for the people that had to back out for this case.
-
There is NOTHING in current law that states I must appoint councel to fit a set criteria for a few unpatient (sic) people.
Impatient? I believe the court has been more than patient with you. You have received far more patient treatment here than would be the case in a number of other regions.
There is also nothing that states that the court must arrange its proceedings around the conditions set by a defendant. As far as I am aware the court has already at least once set a date and time for this hearing. I would like to know from a court official why this hearing did not take place as scheduled.
I believe that the court has bent over backwards to accommodate you, Govindia, and it is now time for people to realise that the court is in charge.
You are NOT the court, Flem.
Where have I suggested that I am? If I was the court, this hearing would have finished by now.
I am innocent until PROVEN guilty, and as such, I have a right to trial, which I have requested, and I have councel (sic) ready.
Also, I have not suggested that you are not innocent until proven guilty. I do not know where you have got that from. What I have suggested is that you are being (deliberately?) obstructive. The court stated way back that your trial would be on IRC. Rather than work to that, you have just sat back and whined about it.
In fact, what many people may have forgotten was that an IRC trial was first requested by your (then) defence team. I quote from the original court docket:
As per the established procedures I expect a trial to be opened as promptly as possible or one scheduled for something like IRC.
Just because you changed your defence team and appointed counsel who cannot access IRC, why should the court then shift to accommodate that? What if, once a trial was set for the forum, you appointed new members of your team who were banned from this forum? Would the court then have to move again to accommodate you?
If that is so, then a thought has just occurred to me. I suggest you appoint my father Jim to your team. He does not own a computer, and is housebound and does not have access to an internet cafe. But he writes a good letter, and I am sure he would be willing to conduct your defence by snail mail. By the argument already used by you, it would be grossly unfair of the court not to accommodate you by conducting the trial by letter.
Absurd? So is you appointing a defence team that cannot access the medium your counsel recommended for the trial, and then whining as if it is the court's fault.
Like many Taijituans, I am fed up with this. Just hold the bloody trial. Hold it on IRC, over the course of one evening. Make a judgement, and let us move on.
-
PRagmia: I would happily act as a justice in this, just to get it moving. BUT the defence might not be willing to accept me as judge, since I was the delegate who confirmed Govindia's original banning.
they also might find me less accommodating to their whim-of-the-day than the current court officials have been.
-
Well, you should have thought of that, before setting the record straight.;) (As you might have guessed, the first date set for this trial failed as people failed to show up on both sides).
Seeing how this attempt at a judicial exercise has failed (that is precisely why I want to avoid a forum trial) I will second Flem's proposal. Wait, no. That is the only way I am still willing to do this. An IRC trial, held in a single session. No offense meant to the defence, but I, for one, am not waisting any more time on hanging around and attempting to prove what already is of an obvious nature. If that cannot be accomplished, please consider my resignation as prosecutor.
Not attempting to add any pressure to this situation, but I am fed up to see a poisonous insect nesting in our inability to organize and hold a trial.
-
PRagmia: I would happily act as a justice in this, just to get it moving. BUT the defence might not be willing to accept me as judge, since I was the delegate who confirmed Govindia's original banning.
I know. As I said good options are limited.
-
Al' would also be nice, but I know she's been busy lately.
I want to see something started by this Saturday, else I may very well be forced to take matters into my own hands.
As of this week I have become considerably less busy and now have more free time to sit in my little office (pray that I've not cursed myself by uttering such). That being said, I would be willing to stand as a Justice, if no one else is fit and able to fill the position.
My concern would be that I am only available from 12:00-20:20 GMT and would have to temporarily excuse myself from IRC were work to come up that could not be accomplished simultaneously. This sort of thing is a concern for most people, of course, as we all have real lives that can potentially interfere with online activities, but I wanted to state it for the record.
-
I'd be glad to help out with a forum based trial should be services be required
:)
-
Okay, this is what is going to happen. It's time for an end to be put to this once and for all.
The trial will begin on the forum. I would prefer IRC, but I've waited long enough for one to be arranged and time zone differences present a troublesome impracticality.
It will be run as follows. This schedule is set, no exceptions will be allowed.
- 2 days will be allowed in which the Prosecution may present their case, including any and all evidence and witnesses they wish to present.
- After the prosecution has presented their case or 2 days have passed the Defense will be give 2 days in which they may present their case, including any and all evidence and witnesses they wish to present.
- After the defense has presented their case or 2 days have passed 4 days will be allowed in which both sides may make rebuttals and during which Justices may ask questions of both the prosecution and the defense.
- 2 days will be allowed after this in which both sides may make a closing argument.
- Once both sides have made their closing arguments Justices will then have 4 days in which to discuss and vote on a final verdict.
At the very latest it will take until the 24th to reach a decision. Preferably we can move faster than that.
If either side has any evidence or witnesses which they want to present, prepare them now. You will not be afforded any extra time during the trial under any circumstances
The only people allowed to post in the trial thread are the Justices, Prosecution and Defense. Anyone else posting will be considered a deliberate attempt to derail the trial. Any issues can be delivered to the Justices via a PM.
This trial will start next week's Monday on the 10th of December, no exceptions. The prosecution shall be the Government of Taijitu. The Defense shall be Govindia. The Justices will be Gallipoli-China, Allama and TGR. If anyone of them for some reason is not available Tacolicious will take their place.
-
Excellent.
-
Excellent, indeed.
Note: As of this announcement I will serve as a witness for neither the defense nor prosecution, as this would present a grave conflict of interest.
-
All I can say is, ABOUT TIME THIS GOT STARTED!
Ahh, I feel better now. ^_^
-
Gd, thank you!
-
My defence team of Osafune and Templarios thank Delegate Pragmia for finally being willing to resolve this and will do our best to cooperate with the court so this can reach a fair, quick, and just end.
Thank you.
-
My thanks goes out to Prag, Al, G-C, and anyone else I might have missed without whom, this may not have been possible :clap:
-
Finally I get my chance to obstruct "justice."
-
Soly, My... Can you respond to the pms I sent you, please?
-
A little less than two months later... :clap:
-
Wow... It really has been that long o.O
-
i think this is in order
HOLY KA-BOOM CRAP!!!
There we go. who won, anyway?
-
1. Don't spam the Court forums
2.It hasn't started.
3. That is now the single most annoying most on the forum.
4. Thank you for destroying my sanity. >_>
-
i thought you guys figured it out. you spent 13 pages of talking about this. thats sad...and the sanity thing, i already lost mine\
-
Well Bara, if you read it you'd know it starts this coming Monday.
-
oh.
-
I just want to thank Prag and the Justices for getting this going :clap:
(http://www.notmike.com/images/procrastination.jpg)
-
mammamia...I read all 13 pages...so, the trial will be on the forum--when exactly? will citizens be permitted to attend?
-
No - only defense, prosecution and justices are allowed to post
-
....by attend, I meant, the hearing will be on an open board, anyone can read it while it takes place, it will be aired publicly rather than privately.
-
Yes
-
whoo
-
The only people allowed to post in the trial thread are the Justices, Prosecution and Defense. Anyone else posting will be considered a deliberate attempt to derail the trial. Any issues can be delivered to the Justices via a PM.
You can watch and read Bara but no posting...
-
ok.
-
Is the trial being conducted in mime? It seems very quiet.
(http://www.geocities.com/vgvegas/Mime_Headshot.jpg)
-
Well, its day two of the prosecution statements with their evidence...
-
This is starting to become very concerning; we need the prosecution to present their case post haste or this trial will very nearly cease to be one.
-
My apologies, RL issues have kept me away. It will be taken care of within the next 24 h.
-
Yay, PoD is here! All is now well in my little world. :)
-
Lol at Flem.
-
PM me when you need my testimony.
-
Myro, please PM Osafune or Templarios, or TG me with your testimony. We are waiting>
-
The behaviour of the MoRS shows that he did not just act because Govindia was a security threat, it was because he came from a feeder that was an active defender.
Does the defence seriously think I would have confirmed the forum restriction of anyone on the grounds they were an active defender?
-
The behaviour of the MoRS shows that he did not just act because Govindia was a security threat, it was because he came from a feeder that was an active defender.
Does the defence seriously think I would have confirmed the forum restriction of anyone on the grounds they were an active defender?
This thread is only for the defence, prosecution, and the Justices. Please refrain from posting. Thank you.
-
No.
This is not how it works.
You do not give orders in my courtroom. You will be respectful, and do your best not to be a moron, that is, look at all the other posts in this thread, and see how many of those weren't from a justice, or your embarrassingly inept prosecution team.
-
No.
This is not how it works.
You do not give orders in my courtroom. You will be respectful, and do your best not to be a moron, that is, look at all the other posts in this thread, and see how many of those weren't from a justice, or your embarrassingly inept prosecution team.
With all due respect, Durnia, there are three justices currently involved in this trial. If I recall correctly, you recused yourself. Furthermore, I object to such flaming language, accusing my DEFENCE team of being inept, when it is in no place for you as a justice to comment on the case when you have recused yourself, by standard ethics. The three justices have stated that only the prosecution, defence, and those justices involved in the case can post, and no one else. I do not see what the problem is in that policy to be understood, sir.
-
The behaviour of the MoRS shows that he did not just act because Govindia was a security threat, it was because he came from a feeder that was an active defender.
Does the defence seriously think I would have confirmed the forum restriction of anyone on the grounds they were an active defender?
This thread is only for the defence, prosecution, and the Justices. Please refrain from posting. Thank you.
I must second the idea of Durnia's post on this, delicacy of language aside. This thread has been full of posts by people other than those you listed and you choose to protest when a user who happens to have been directly involved in the banning as the Delegate of the time becomes involved in the discussion. Flem's post was both relevant and appropriate, while yours assumed more authority than it possessed. Please refrain from ordering people about.
...when it is in no place for you as a justice to comment on the case when you have recused yourself, by standard ethics. The three justices have stated that only the prosecution, defence, and those justices involved in the case can post, and no one else.
You say "with all due respect" but then go on to be highly disrespectful. Durnia may have recused himself, but he is as much a member of this community as you are and has an equal right to express his opinion. Responding to his comments would be perfectly fine, but you ought not accuse someone of being rude and then be rude yourself.
Also, this is not the trial thread. Outside input is not disallowed here and I know nothing of "standard ethics" that would mean Durnia should not post here. Should he have been more polite? I would definitely say so. Should he have kept his thoughts to himself? No.
-
My apologies Madame Justice. I was under the impression that the restrictions of the trial thread occurred here as well since the trial began.
-
With all due respect, Durnia, there are three justices currently involved in this trial. If I recall correctly, you recused yourself. Furthermore, I object to such flaming language, accusing my DEFENCE team of being inept, when it is in no place for you as a justice to comment on the case when you have recused yourself, by standard ethics. The three justices have stated that only the prosecution, defence, and those justices involved in the case can post, and no one else. I do not see what the problem is in that policy to be understood, sir.
Yes, you will show some respect.
As for flaming, I would have thought you would have got used to being called a moron by now; some facts simply cannot be ignored.
As for your "defence", again see above.
I am perfectly within to comment on anything as I see fit, you don't like it? Why not take it to the courts?
As for rudeness, indeed. I am frequently brash, arrogant, and cutting. As for a solution, again see above.
-
This feels like a breath of fresh air. Could we call this thread "The Judicial Caffe" ?
*sits down and orders a long espresso* I am terribly happy that we have no 'community service' sentences, or else I might see Govindia here, serving the customers, and that might prove dangerous. For their health.
-
Me thunked this was not the trial thread but a comment thread?
I will now entertain you with a mime:
Thank you.
Why the mime? Because we are in the region of Taijitu, the balance of yin and yang. Having produced a post that was relevant and appropriate, I felt the need to produce one that was irrelevant and inappropriate.
Thus the harmony of the universe is restored. No need to thank me.
-
Gov didn't order anything, he made a request.
Yes, you will show some respect.
THAT is an order.
Why does the link at the bottom of the page that is supposed to take you to page 15 of this topic take you to some OOC topic in the rp forums instead? I had to make a post here to even see what was on this page.
-
Gov didn't order anything, he made a request.
Yes, you will show some respect.
THAT is an order.
Why does the link at the bottom of the page that is supposed to take you to page 15 of this topic take you to some OOC topic in the rp forums instead? I had to make a post here to even see what was on this page.
Yeah, that is a strange glitch!
-
We finally agree on something. Odd one, indeed.
*reminds Osamafune that a Judge may order a defendant in his or her Courtroom while having the defendant boss around the Delegate and a Judge looks stupid and disrespectful at best*
-
*reminds Osamafune that a Judge may order a defendant in his or her Courtroom while having the defendant boss around the Delegate and a Judge looks stupid and disrespectful at best*
Since Durnia recused himself, he shouldn't be in the courtroom anyway :P
And the defendant wasn't bossing around anyone.
-
*reminds Osamafune that a Judge may order a defendant in his or her Courtroom while having the defendant boss around the Delegate and a Judge looks stupid and disrespectful at best*
Since Durnia recused himself, he shouldn't be in the courtroom anyway :P
And the defendant wasn't bossing around anyone.
Durnia may certainly be in the Courtroom as a Justice; he still holds that position whether or not he has been recused from a particular trial. Also, the restrictions mentioned were only for the trial thread so it matter not what his rank is.
As to bossing, the defendant told someone to stop posting. He may have used the word "please" but it was not phrased as a request so much as a polite order. It is over with now and he has apologized, so let us not discuss it further.
-
I was being sarcastic you know, hence the :P
-
:D I was just admiring Osamafune's dedication to his client even outside the trial thread. :P
-
I was being sarcastic you know, hence the :P
Ah, I missed that bit.
-
He claims to have acted by "instinct," instinct which could have clearly been clouded by him not liking Govindia, as Flemingovia also testified too.
Clever work by Osamafune. He implies from my testimony that my banning of Govindia may have been influenced by my dislike of him personally.
However, the defence is (deliberately?) confusing time scales. They asked me why I banned Govindia then and then asked me what is my opinion of Govindia now
Then Osamafune put the two together. hmmmmm.
In fact, as many will tell you, at the time of the banning I was one of those arguing in favour of leniency towards Govindia and had expressed the opinion many times that he was not as bad as several people were making out.
It was only later, after the banning, that I wised up.
-
After hundreds of posts, weeks of debate, a judicial decision and even potential spin-off miniseries, I am amazed that this is still dragging out. As Cary Grant once said in a movie, "sometimes you just need to take your licks like a man."
Govindia and his team would gain much respect in my eyes if they just took it on the chin rather than running round complaining like this.
-
We're not complaining about the verdict. I've personally taken that as a victory. What we're complaining about is the blatant admin abuse going on.