Taijitu
Government of Taijitu => The Ecclesia => Proposals and Discussion => Topic started by: Gulliver on February 09, 2015, 12:37:32 AM
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Our current oath of citizenship, I find, is a bit awkwardly worded in parts, and contains at least one spelling error. As such, I would like to propose that we amend the Citizenship Act to update it:
I, ([forum name)] hereby in sober mind, and good conscious conscience, hereby declare my loyalty to the People Citizens' Democracy of Taijitu, and to the principles which our state is founded upon, those being Direct Democracy, and Egalitarianism, of the Glorious Revolution. I promise swear to respect and uphold, as both a Citizen and Member of the Ecclesia, the Constitution, Bill of Rights, the Standing Ordinances of the Ecclesia and the Glorious Revolution, and the laws which are currently in effect, adopted by the Ecclesia. and I understand recognize that should I break my oath or any term dictated above I shall be prosecuted within to the fullest extent of the law and that my citizenship may be forfeit., in good conscience do I promise.
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yes please :taijitu:
This or get rid of the oath :keke:
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Excellent, but if I may - the first instance of "Citizens' Democracy" in the proposed oath is missing the possessive apostrophe.
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You are correct, I'll add it.
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It looks better, the language is clearer. Is the sober mind bit necessary? Could one be proven to be under the influence while swearing the oath?
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I was wondering about the sober mind thing too. :P Otherwise, I like this much better!
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I like this much better. I'm okay with keeping the "sober mind" phrasing as it is. It reinforces the voluntary nature of the oath, but I would also understand if people want it removed.
To ask a stupid question: this wouldn't force citizens to retake the oath, correct? All existing citizens would be grandfathered in?
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As per the other relevant sections of the Legislation Concerning Citizenship (http://forum.taijitu.org/legislative-and-treaty-votes/legislation-concerning-citizenship-8834/) any existing citizens would not need to retake the oath.
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I'm excited that this validates the Taijitu government as one that exists as a revolution, and not simply a product of it.
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I'm excited that this validates the Taijitu government as one that exists as a revolution, and not simply a product of it.
Agreed heartily. I move we push this to a vote.
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Thanks, al 'Khem! I figured that would be true, but it's better to be safe than sorry. ;D
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I'm excited that this validates the Taijitu government as one that exists as a revolution, and not simply a product of it.
Agreed heartily. I move we push this to a vote.
Seconded all 'round! Clear and concise language is always best in an oath.
To ask a stupid question: this wouldn't force citizens to retake the oath, correct? All existing citizens would be grandfathered in?
Not at all a stupid question. :)
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I'll move this to a vote in about 2 days if there are no objections.
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I still have objections to the "sober mind" bit.
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I still have objections to the "sober mind" bit.
it does go against the teachings of the most prominent religion in Taijitu.
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I still have objections to the "sober mind" bit.
it does go against the teachings of the most prominent religion in Taijitu.
...and those who choose to not be sober.
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I don't think the "sober mind" clause is telling people not to drink what they want to drink or smoke what they want to smoke or anything like that. If it said that, I think we'd all want it gone. :wine: :drunks:
As I understand it, it's just saying that one can't make the oath while drunk or high. The oath is a serious commitment and requires that the oath taker fully understand what it is they're committing to. That's my interpretation, at least.
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:wine: :drunks: :drunk:
We need more of these, and they would be sad if you included "sober mind". Save them drunks!
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I don't think the "sober mind" clause is telling people not to drink what they want to drink or smoke what they want to smoke or anything like that. If it said that, I think we'd all want it gone. :wine: :drunks:
As I understand it, it's just saying that one can't make the oath while drunk or high. The oath is a serious commitment and requires that the oath taker fully understand what it is they're committing to. That's my interpretation, at least.
I do believe the three of us (al 'Khem, Delfos, and I) are just having some fun and poking at the wording. Ignore us. :-P
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Nope. Not poking fun. I seriously dislike the notion that one can not make rational decisions sans sobriety.
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yeah, and I'm looking out for our religion that forbids long periods of sober.
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You guys... :keke:
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I, [forum name], in able mind and good conscience, hereby declare my loyalty to the Citizens' Democracy of Taijitu and to the principles of the Glorious Revolution. I swear to uphold the Constitution and the laws adopted by the Ecclesia. I recognize that should I break my oath I shall be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law and my citizenship may be forfeit.
How does this edit appear to everyone?
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I, [forum name], in able mind and good conscience, hereby declare my loyalty to the Citizens' Democracy of Taijitu and to the principles of the Glorious Revolution. I swear to uphold the Constitution and the laws adopted by the Ecclesia. I recognize that should I break my oath I shall be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law and my citizenship may be forfeit.
How does this edit appear to everyone?
I much prefer this language.
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:D works for me.
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:D works for me.
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I, [forum name], in able mind and good conscience, hereby declare my loyalty to the Citizens' Democracy of Taijitu and to the principles of the Glorious Revolution. I swear to uphold the Constitution and the laws adopted by the Ecclesia. I recognize that should I break my oath I shall be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law and my citizenship may be forfeit.
How does this edit appear to everyone?
Wondiferous. I move that we put this to a vote.
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I, [forum name], in able mind and good conscience, hereby declare my loyalty to the Citizens' Democracy of Taijitu and to the principles of the Glorious Revolution. I swear to uphold the Constitution and the laws adopted by the Ecclesia. I recognize that should I break my oath I shall be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law and my citizenship may be forfeit.
How does this edit appear to everyone?
Wondiferous. I move that we put this to a vote.
Seconded.
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I like it, but "in able mind" sounds slightly off to me. I think "of able mind and in good conscious would be better:
I, ([forum name)] hereby [st]in sober[/st] [in]of able[/in] mind[st],[/st] and [in]in[/in] good conscious conscience, [in]do[/in] hereby declare my loyalty to the People Citizens' Democracy of Taijitu, and to the principles which our state is founded upon, those being Direct Democracy, and Egalitarianism, of the Glorious Revolution. I promise swear to respect and uphold, as both a Citizen and Member of the Ecclesia, the Constitution, Bill of Rights, the Standing Ordinances of the Ecclesia and the Glorious Revolution, and the laws which are currently in effect, adopted by the Ecclesia. and I understand recognize that should I break my oath or any term dictated above I shall be prosecuted within to the fullest extent of the law and that my citizenship may be forfeit., in good conscience do I promise.
"Sound" might read better than "able" as well but I'm on the fence about that since it's nitpicky.
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I like it, but "in able mind" sounds slightly off to me. I think "of able mind and in good conscious would be better:
I, ([forum name)] hereby in sober of able mind, and in good conscious conscience, do hereby declare my loyalty to the People Citizens' Democracy of Taijitu, and to the principles which our state is founded upon, those being Direct Democracy, and Egalitarianism, of the Glorious Revolution. I promise swear to respect and uphold, as both a Citizen and Member of the Ecclesia, the Constitution, Bill of Rights, the Standing Ordinances of the Ecclesia and the Glorious Revolution, and the laws which are currently in effect, adopted by the Ecclesia. and I understand recognize that should I break my oath or any term dictated above I shall be prosecuted within to the fullest extent of the law and that my citizenship may be forfeit., in good conscience do I promise.
"Sound" might read better than "able" as well but I'm on the fence about that since it's nitpicky.
sound sounds good too, since this is clearly an alternative, you can put the alternatives in the vote, reserving a last one to Do not change the Oath of Citizenship, yet I wish there would also be an option to remove the Oath entirely.
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yet I wish there would also be an option to remove the Oath entirely.
Any Citizen can propose changes to our laws. If you want to strike down the oath entirely, write up legislation saying so and make your case to the Ecclesia.
This proposal is for changing the oath, however, so I don't feel "remove it" would be a relevant option in this particular vote.
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precisely, well put m'am.
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I move for a vote on the following proposal:
I, ([forum name)] hereby in isober sound mind, and good conscious conscience, do hereby declare my loyalty to the People Citizens' Democracy of Taijitu, and to the principles which our state is founded upon, those being Direct Democracy, and Egalitarianism, of the Glorious Revolution. I promise swear to respect and uphold, as both a Citizen and Member of the Ecclesia, the Constitution, Bill of Rights, the Standing Ordinances of the Ecclesia and the Glorious Revolution, and the laws which are currently in effect, adopted by the Ecclesia. and I understand recognize that should I break my oath or any term dictated above I shall be prosecuted within to the fullest extent of the law and that my citizenship may be forfeit., in good conscience do I promise.
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Seconded.
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I will move this to a vote in a couple of days if no objections are raised.
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great improvement
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great improvement
Indeed.
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Nice rewording. +1
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Nice catch :fro: