Taijitu
Government of Taijitu => The Ecclesia => Proposals and Discussion => Topic started by: Khem on March 17, 2015, 04:40:05 AM
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As I posted in Spammy Posts (http://forum.taijitu.org/proposals-and-discussions/spammy-posts/msg153482/#msg153482) and was touched on by others our system of post count titles may be inegaletarian and thus subject to discussion of change. Should we endeavor to do such? Is it worthwhile? Could we enshrine further messages of the Glorious Revolution in this act? I of course lean towards yes to all these questions.
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I have no strong feelings one way or the other.
I can see both sides, that is.
That said, I'd like to pipe in to say that it is technically possible to change or remove the post count titles, or even remove the visible post count itself next to posts.
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Wouldn't this line of thinking apply to all titles? Including titles denoted by elected office?
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Wouldn't this line of thinking apply to all titles? Including titles denoted by elected office?
That doesn't make sense. One cannot elect someone to an office without giving that office some sort of designation. Otherwise it's impossible to refer to it in conversation or law. That's just how language works. :P
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If people feel very strongly about it, I wouldn't mind hiding the post ranks. However, I think we should keep post counts visible.
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I agree with Dyr on this one.
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If people feel very strongly about it, I wouldn't mind hiding the post ranks. However, I think we should keep post counts visible.
Also agreed. Hiding the ranks jives with our egalitarian system.
Post counts, however, are a simple statistic, indicative neither of title nor rank when displayed alone.
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If people feel very strongly about it, I wouldn't mind hiding the post ranks. However, I think we should keep post counts visible.
Also agreed. Hiding the ranks jives with our egalitarian system.
Post counts, however, are a simple statistic, indicative neither of title nor rank when displayed alone.
and completely useless. Why do you need to know every time someone posts how many posts he has made? If you're that curious you can see his profile and all those stats 1 click away.
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Wouldn't this line of thinking apply to all titles? Including titles denoted by elected office?
That doesn't make sense. One cannot elect someone to an office without giving that office some sort of designation. Otherwise it's impossible to refer to it in conversation or law. That's just how language works. :P
Says the Padishah Empress. :keke:
Well, we did get rid of address by noble titles, but we do not address each other by "Spam Deity Bustos" or such. I just see this as superfluous.
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Wouldn't this line of thinking apply to all titles? Including titles denoted by elected office?
That doesn't make sense. One cannot elect someone to an office without giving that office some sort of designation. Otherwise it's impossible to refer to it in conversation or law. That's just how language works. :P
Says the Padishah Empress. :keke:
Well, we did get rid of address by noble titles, but we do not address each other by "Spam Deity Bustos" or such. I just see this as superfluous.
Hahaha I'd forgotten I made that my custom banner thing. Will have to change it!
What's the connection between noble titles/post-count titles and elected offices, though? I'm sorry if I'm being obtuse but I still don't get it.
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How did the post count/title thing even start?
The connection is, it's a title.
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What is the procedure for the Ecclesia wanting to change an administrative thing on the forums?
We demand it to be erased by the forum administration?
Also, I think there's people wanting to sabotage the real deal. This is about post count titles/ranks, we could by extension discuss the post count itself, which imo should also be erased bc it's completely useless and holds no practical value, but as we can all witness: the "post count titles" or ranks have much more people against it and I'd like to explore and spearhead that option first. A "Package deal" on this proposal would most likely fail.
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Agreed, so as to the titles, should they be abolished or altered?
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Let's just get rid of the post-count-based titles.
As to the post counts themselves, it's an interesting and fun statistic but it isn't strictly necessary. Whatever the Ecclesia wishes on that is fine by me.
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Unless there's an objection within a reasonable amount of time (let's say a week) I suggest an admin (i.e. me) just remove the postcount titles.
If there is an objection, we can have a formal vote on a proposal to end post count titles on the regional forum.
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In favor. All against rise:
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rises
I object.
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I push the abolition of post count ranks or titles to a vote.
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Wait, is it titles or post count or both?
I thought it was agreed on title only.
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We need legislation created before we can vote on such.
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Unless there's an objection within a reasonable amount of time (let's say a week) I suggest an admin (i.e. me) just remove the postcount titles.
If there is an objection, we can have a formal vote on a proposal to end post count titles on the regional forum.
Implied legislation wasn't needed.
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With objection to the action we will need a formal vote. Which requires at least a basic sentence describing what the matter at hand is that is being put into law.
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Oh, I just looked at this as "technical" issue, rather than a "legal, gotta draft a law" issue.
VERY*LATE*EDIT (I hadnt refreshed to see al'Khem's post): For example...
http://forum.taijitu.org/legislative-and-treaty-votes/new-world-factbook-entry/
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rises
I object.
I was basing the need to be legislative on the above.
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Oh, I just looked at this as "technical" issue, rather than a "legal, gotta draft a law" issue.
EDIT: For example...
http://forum.taijitu.org/legislative-and-treaty-votes/new-world-factbook-entry/
Don't know if u caught my example. But I was using this as a precedent for a technical issue not needing specific legislation. But, hey, if someone wants to make the proposal, potentially, into a law, knock yourself out and do a draft.
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I had not! The question becomes is it worth legislating vs just happening?
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Oh, I just looked at this as "technical" issue, rather than a "legal, gotta draft a law" issue.
EDIT: For example...
http://forum.taijitu.org/legislative-and-treaty-votes/new-world-factbook-entry/
Don't know if u caught my example. But I was using this as a precedent for a technical issue not needing specific legislation. But, hey, if someone wants to make the proposal, potentially, into a law, knock yourself out and do a draft.
Unless there's an objection within a reasonable amount of time (let's say a week) I suggest an admin (i.e. me) just remove the postcount titles.
If there is an objection, we can have a formal vote on a proposal to end post count titles on the regional forum.
Implied legislation wasn't needed.
That did imply legislation wasn't needed, absolutely... unless someone objects.
You objected. Legislation is therefore required.
If you want to switch this back over to a technical issue requiring no legal changes, you could probably withdraw your objection (should that suit you). :)
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I guess, I am not following how having a vote requires legislation. As a precedent has already been set where a technical issue did not require legislation for a vote. I am just confused why the "need" for legislation, rather than a simple vote. But, as long as a vote happens, I don't care how it comes about. Just a matter of curiosity, on my part.
:taijitu:
So, back to an earlier question which needs to be decided upon in any case, are we voting on removal of post titles or post counts or both?
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Just titles...
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I push the abolition of post count ranks or titles to a vote.
After re-reading this a few times, I see he didn't mean post count as a separate thing but pertaining to titles/ranks.
I second this motion.
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Just titles...
for now...
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I'm in the no strong feelings one way or another camp on this.
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I am also indifferent. I would like to say, however, that I don't think the post titles contradict our egalitarian principles; it's just that removing them may fit better with our revolutionary theme and no one cares about them anyway.
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So by and large we have indifference to this with a few pockets of those who believe extremely that post-count titles should be removed.
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I don't think anyone cared for the titles in the first place. They're just something that these forums tend to have, so we were used to it.
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I don't think anyone cared for the titles in the first place. They're just something that these forums tend to have, so we were used to it.
Wast is always right.
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Can we get a vote? After this, I want to address the post-count :P
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Poll added.
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Poll added.
I approve the choices on this poll adding a 4th option from the traditional method.
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Shouldn't there be a thread for the voting in the Legislative And Treaty Votes forum?
Or is this a poll to get a feel how people feel about the post titles?
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Just a poll to get the feel, though I fear with the showing so far it will require an actual vote thread.
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Hi all,
Sorry for being absent from the debate.
My original reaction was against the titles. I have never had anything against a count. Just statistics, read into that whatever you will.
A title based on a volume of produced posts is completely irrelevant and anti-egalitarian and is against the spirit of the revolution. To propose to "Change it to something more revolutionary" is like giving the king another title, like "Il Duce". Same crap.
Post related titles are anti-egalitarian! End of!
Either we get rid of them or we stand to be called hypocrites. If we changed our calendar this should not pose a problem.
Linda
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This poll has been running for a while now...
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I move that this be put to proper vote.
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Proper vote: fine
However: I demand that the issue should be:
Abolish titles.
Keep titles.
Abstain.
If we decide to keep the titles, THEN we can bring up a possible change of the titles to something more revolutionary (to try to hide the fact that we are pissing on the revolution).
;D
L
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I move to vote on abolishing post count titles.
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second
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thirdeded
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I'll move this to vote tomorrow.