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Author Topic: Procedures  (Read 3618 times)

Offline Eluvatar

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Procedures
« on: July 07, 2014, 03:48:25 AM »
Draft

I took the old 2007-2008 Senate Procedures and adjusted them for the new constitution, then replaced "shall" with "will".

After starting this topic and discussing some matters, I made some further changes.

Quote from: Revised Draft Text
Voting Procedures
  • All votes will be one week in duration unless otherwise specified.
  • Councillors who abstain or do not vote will not be considered when determining the outcome of a vote.

Procedures for Simple Legislation
  • Any Councillor may propose a bill within the Council Halls, where all Councillors may freely debate and propose modifications to the bill.
  • A proposal must offer Councillors the option to nominate, dismiss, or extend debate.
  • Should a third of Councillors nominate the bill, it will be moved to the Council Floor for a vote.
  • Should two thirds of Councillors motion to dismiss the bill debate on the bill will be closed, and the bill may not be reintroduced until a week has expired.
  • Debate on a proposed bill will be open for the duration of a week or until the bill has garnered sufficient nominations to be moved to the floor, whichever comes first.
  • The period for debate may be extended by the duration of a week should a third of Councillors motion to extend the period for debate.
  • Should a bill fail to garner sufficient support to be moved to the floor after a week has expired and no motion to extend debate has succeeded debate will be closed and the bill may not be reintroduced until another week has expired.
  • The Speaker may request new nominations for a bill should in their opinion the content of the bill have changed sufficiently.
  • A simple majority will be necessary for the passage of simple legislation and the Speaker will present a passed bill to the Senate for review.
  • Should a bill be vetoed by the Senate, any Councillor may ask for a vote to override the veto within a week of the veto.

Procedures for Treaty Ratification
  • Should the Senate approve a treaty negotiated by the Delegate, a debate will be opened on the treaty within the Council Halls or Council Chambers if a sensitive discussion by the suggestion of the Delegate.
  • The debate must offer Councillors the option to call for a vote or extend debate.
  • Should a third of Councillors call for a vote, it will be moved to the Council Floor for a vote.
  • Debate on an approved treaty will be open for the duration of one week or until sufficient Councillors have called for the treaty to be moved to the floor, whichever comes first.
  • The period for debate may be extended by the duration of a week should a third of Councillors motion to extend the period for debate.
  • Absent Councillors will not be taken into consideration when determining whether enough Councillors have called for a treaty to be moved to the floor.
  • A simple majority will be necessary to ratify a treaty.

Procedures for Council Applications
  • Should a citizen who has met the requirements enumerated within the Constitution request entrance to the Council a review will be opened within the Council.
  • Reviews on applicants will be open to all Councillors for the duration of a week, after which the review will be concluded and a vote to admit the application will be opened.
  • A simple majority will be necessary to admit an applicant.

Procedures for the Election of the Speaker of the Council
  • The Speaker will be elected by Approval vote.
  • Should there be a tie in an election for Speaker, the Councillor with the greatest seniority in the Council will be elected.
  • Scheduled elections for the Speaker will be held in the months of January, May and August, with the Delegate or their appointee acting as election officer.
  • Election proceedings will begin on the seventeenth day of the month, at which point nominations will be opened within  the Council.
  • Nominations will be concluded on the twenty first day of the month.
  • Campaigns will be concluded on the twenty fourth day of the month, at which point a vote will be opened on the floor.
  • Voting will be concluded on the thirtieth day of the month, and the Speaker of the Council Elect will be sworn into office on the first day of the following month.

Procedures for the Emergency Election of the Speaker of the Council
  • Should the office of the Speaker of the Council be vacant, or should a motion for a Vote of No Confidence be made against the Speaker of the Council, provided that Emergency Election Procedures are not presently in motion, nominations will be opened within the Council for the duration of seven days and any candidate may begin to campaign for the office of the Speaker of the Council.
  • Nominations will be closed after the seventh day and a vote will be opened on the Council Floor for the duration of a week. Should Emergency Election Procedures have been initiated as the result of a Motion of No Confidence against the Speaker of the Council a vote will only be held if the Speaker of the Council of has been removed from office as a result.
  • After a week has expired the vote will be closed, and the Speaker of the Council Elect will be sworn into office within the following three days.
  • Should the period for emergency election procedures for the Speaker extend into the period for the general election of the Speaker, no emergency election will be held.

Procedures for a Vote of No Confidence
  • Any Councillor may motion for a vote of no confidence within the Council.
  • Should a Councillor motion for a vote of no confidence a vote will be opened on the Council Floor.
  • A simple majority will be necessary for a vote of no confidence to pass and for the Speaker to be removed from office.

Procedures for the Removal of Councillors
  • Any Councillor may motion to remove from the Council any of its members.
  • Should a Councillor motion to remove a Councillor from office a vote will be opened on the Council Floor.
  • A two-thirds majority will be necessary for a Councillor to be removed from office.

Procedures for Leaves of Absence and Missed Votes
  • Councillors may request a leave of absence, not to exceed two months in duration, and will be obliged when they do so to provide the dates of their absence.
  • Councillors may not apply for a leave of absence within a week of having completed another.
  • Should a Councillor miss three consecutive votes without having applied for a leave of absence in advance a vote on the removal of the Councillor from office will be opened on the Council Floor, except when the Councillor in question was serving as Delegate at the time of the votes.
  • Absent Councillors will not be taken into consideration when determining whether a matter has accrued enough nominations to be moved to the floor or if a motion to dismiss a matter, move it to a vote, or extend a period for debate is successful.

The Speaker pro Tempore
  • The Speaker will have the power to appoint at their discretion any number of Councillors, to be ranked in whatever order of preference they choose, to the office of Speaker pro Tempore.
  • Should the Speaker be unable to perform their duties or their office be left vacant the highest ranked Speaker pro Tempore of those present will assume the duties of the Speaker until a new Speaker has been elected.
  • The Speaker may not appoint the current Delegate or the Vice Delegate to the office of Speaker pro Tempore.

Procedures for Impeachment
  • Should the Senate impeach the Delegate, a debate will be opened on removing the Delegate within the Council Halls.
  • The debate must offer Councillors the option to call for a vote or extend debate.
  • Debate on removing the Delegate will be open for the duration of one week or until a third of Councillors have called for a vote, whichever comes first.
  • The period for debate may be extended by the duration of a week should a third of Councillors motion to extend the period for debate.
  • When debate is ended, it will be moved to the Council Floor for a vote.
  • A two-thirds majority will be necessary to remove the Delegate.

Procedures for Constitutional Amendments
  • Any Councillor may propose an amendment within the Council Halls, wherein all Councillors may freely debate and propose modifications to the amendment.
  • A proposal must offer Councillors the option to nominate, dismiss, or extend debate.
  • Should a half of Councillors nominate the amendment, it will be moved to the Council floor for a vote.
  • Should a half of Councillors motion to dismiss the amendment debate on the amendment will be closed, and the amendment may not be reintroduced until a week has expired.
  • Debate on a proposed amendment will be open for the duration of a week or until the amendment has garnered sufficient nominations to be moved to the floor, whichever comes first.
  • The period for debate may be extended by the duration of a week should a third of Councillors motion to extend the period for debate.
  • Should an amendment fail to garner sufficient support to be moved to the floor after a week has expired and no motion to extend debate has succeeded debate will be closed and the amendment may not be reintroduced until another week has expired.
  • The Speaker may request new nominations for an amendment should in their opinion the content of the bill have changed sufficiently.
  • Should a two thirds majority vote for the bill, the Speaker will present the bill to the Senate for ratification.
I still think parts of it are a touch verbose.

Once we've revised this to a point we're satisfied with it, we can bring this to a vote.

I will bring a set of procedures to a vote if there is a motion and a second on a particular text.
« Last Edit: July 08, 2014, 02:40:35 PM by Eluvatar »
                                 
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Offline Eluvatar

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Re: Procedures
« Reply #1 on: July 08, 2014, 02:28:55 AM »
Quote from: #taijitu (timestamps EDT)
22:07 <@Eluvatar> The parts I added, I took care to use the same style as the rest of it
...
22:07 <@Eluvatar> so one probably doesn't need to read the whole thing to make suggestions on style
22:07 <@Eluvatar> and the style feels verbose to me
22:08 <@Eluvatar> oh also I accidentally removed something that we might want to put back:
22:08 <@Eluvatar> (in some form)
22:08 <@Eluvatar> # The votes of Senators who abstain, are absent, whether with or without previous notice, or are serving as Delegate shall not be considered when determining the outcome of a vote.
22:08 <@Eluvatar> so perhaps that, changed to:
22:09 <@Eluvatar> # The votes of Senators who abstain or are absent whether with or without previous notice shall not be considered when determining the outcome of a vote.
22:09 <@Eluvatar> (not including stylistic changes)
22:09 <@Funkadelia> ok
22:09 <@Funkadelia> thats a good idea to add
22:09 <@Eluvatar> or do you think the Council should bar the Delegate from voting like the old Senate used to? >_<
22:09 <@Eluvatar> though I think that may have been a constitutional requirement >_<
22:10 <@Funkadelia> I think that's in the constitution
22:12 <@Eluvatar> > The Delegate may hold membership in the Senate, but shall not be permitted to hold the office of Speaker of the Senate or Justice of the Supreme Court and shall not be permitted to vote except in the event of a tie, wherein they shall cast the deciding vote.
22:12 <@Eluvatar> http://wiki.taijitu.org/w/index.php?title=Document:Constitution_of_Taijitu&oldid=3027
22:12 <@Eluvatar> http://wiki.taijitu.org/w/index.php?title=Document:Constitution_of_Taijitu&diff=3278&oldid=3148
22:12 <@Eluvatar> and they got rid of that clause 29 September 2007
22:13 <@Eluvatar> so I don't think we even _could_ include such a bar in our procedures if we wanted to :P
22:14 <@Eluvatar> So, the procedures have this oddity:
22:14 <@Eluvatar> # Should a third of Councillors nominate the bill, it will be moved to the Council Floor for a vote not to exceed a week in duration.
22:14 <@Eluvatar> -- memory says that what this meant is if an absolute majority was reached, the vote could be closed early at the discretion of the Speaker
22:15 <@Eluvatar> and that is primarily what the not-counted bit we're talking about was for, I think
22:15 <@Funkadelia> ok
22:15 <@Eluvatar> But it doesn't say this, anywhere in the procedures
22:15 <@Eluvatar> Which is funny, given how verbose they otherwise are >_>
22:15 <@Eluvatar> Q1) Is this a good idea?
22:15 <@Funkadelia> Then it's implied
22:15 <@Eluvatar> I think we should keep it simple: votes last a determined period of time, and then end. Full stop.
22:17 <@wast> I agree with
22:17 <@wast> simplicity
22:17 <@wast> (omg hi, etc)
...
22:17 <@Eluvatar> peace be upon you
...
22:18 <@wast> we seem to tend towards excessive complexity
22:18 <@Eluvatar> Sometimes yes
...
22:18 <@wast> Always best to keep things simple,
22:18 <@wast> then wait for them to fail
22:18 <@wast> and allow the bloated rules to grow naturally
22:19 <@Eluvatar> heh
22:19 <@Eluvatar> Funkadelia: agreed to get rid of the variable-length votes?
22:20 <@Eluvatar> What should happen if somebody who's on a leave of absence votes?
22:20 <@Eluvatar> Intuitively it feels to me like that should just end their leave of absence
...
22:23 <@Funkadelia> uh
22:23 <@Funkadelia> i dunno D:
22:23 <@Eluvatar> eh we can leave that out for now
22:24 <@Eluvatar> (the absence question)
22:26 <@Eluvatar> the other source of some complexity, besides variable-length votes is the process for things to go to a vote
22:26 <@Eluvatar> I do remember that working fairly well in 2007 though so I'm fine with leaving it in
22:26 <@Eluvatar> -- some fraction have to nominate a bill, and then the Speaker has to put it to a vote
...
22:29 <@Eluvatar> wast: Funkadelia: do I have your permission to post the log of our chat just now in the Council Halls?
...
22:32 * Eluvatar jumps up and down impatiently for wast and Funkadelia to grant permission ;_;
...
22:35 <@Funkadelia> IM SORRY
22:35 <@Funkadelia> yes
...
22:41 <@wast> SORRY
22:41 <@wast> YES YOU HAVE PERMISSIONS
(Non-relevant bits removed from log.)
« Last Edit: July 08, 2014, 02:44:29 AM by Eluvatar »
                                 
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Offline Eluvatar

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Re: Procedures
« Reply #2 on: July 08, 2014, 03:16:33 AM »
Thinking further, and working partly from the above IRC discussion, I've made some revisions to the draft. I'll update the first post in a bit.
                                 
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Offline Khem

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Re: Procedures
« Reply #3 on: July 08, 2014, 03:37:43 PM »
I approve of the changes. I will get back to y'all tomorrow with proposals of my own.

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Offline Eluvatar

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Re: Procedures
« Reply #4 on: July 09, 2014, 02:30:26 AM »
A side-thought for your consideration, to possibly add:

Quote
Procedures for original members
  • Such members of the Council as were never admitted, but were pronounced the Council's initial membership by the Reform Bill, will be considered "original members".
  • Each original member will face a review of one week in duration, followed by a vote on whether to remove them from the Council.
  • The original members will be reviewed and voted on one by one, in order of seniority.

The basic idea is for us initial Council members to also face the Review process and be Questioned etc :)
                                 
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Offline Khem

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Re: Procedures
« Reply #5 on: July 09, 2014, 04:44:02 PM »
Perhaps an official questionnaire to be posted publicly?

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Offline Lapeirousia

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Re: Procedures
« Reply #6 on: July 11, 2014, 07:02:17 PM »
Okay this is pretty good but I have one thing that I want changed:

The senate must ratify our amendments. What if the senate is inactive or empty? Do we just coup again? Better give the option to bypass the requirement of senate approval in those extreme circumstances.
Niadh Tabaqui Dion Diablessa

Offline Khem

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Re: Procedures
« Reply #7 on: July 11, 2014, 07:15:46 PM »
A good idea Lapeirousia. While not currently empty if such occurs it would be great idea to bypass when it is.

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Offline Lapeirousia

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Re: Procedures
« Reply #8 on: July 16, 2014, 08:29:53 PM »
Or we could just overthrow the government by force of arms. That works too I guess.

I am getting worried about people not being here and I am willing to quit if there's a chance it will bring them back. You can take this post as my due notice.
Niadh Tabaqui Dion Diablessa

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Re: Procedures
« Reply #9 on: July 17, 2014, 12:03:56 AM »
I doubt that's the problem.

Feelings...

Offline Lapeirousia

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Re: Procedures
« Reply #10 on: July 17, 2014, 10:42:42 AM »
Nothing more than feelings.
Niadh Tabaqui Dion Diablessa

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Re: Procedures
« Reply #11 on: July 17, 2014, 03:16:20 PM »
Nothing more than feelings.
trying to forget my...

Offline Eluvatar

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Re: Procedures
« Reply #12 on: July 18, 2014, 05:30:31 PM »
We cannot adopt unconstitutional procedures. The constitution requires Senate approval for amendments.

As it doesn't require Senate approval for laws, I don't think this is a terrible problem.

Re: PBD: I like the idea of a public questionnaire. It can be done as a separate thing from these procedures, though.
                                 
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Offline Lapeirousia

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Re: Procedures
« Reply #13 on: July 19, 2014, 08:31:39 PM »
Then we should pass laws to deal with the eventuality of a vacant or inactive senate. If we lose the senate we lose the ability to change the constitution constitutionally, and frankly that is a great hole in the system that ought to be fixed.

I have been a senator when we were not allowed to change the constitution because the CJ was away and the delegate wouldn't appoint a new one. It was a painful experience.
Niadh Tabaqui Dion Diablessa